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From: pdcr...@orac.iinet.com.au (Patrick D'Cruze)
Subject: An Introduction to Linux International
Message-ID: <1994Mar27.185119.27442@cs.cornell.edu>
Followup-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Keywords: Linux International, support organization
Sender: m...@cs.cornell.edu (Matt Welsh)
Reply-To: pdcr...@orac.iinet.com.au (Patrick D'Cruze)
Organization: None
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 1994 18:51:19 GMT
Approved: linux-annou...@tc.cornell.edu (Matt Welsh)
Lines: 83

Monday 28th March 1994:	An Introduction to Linux International

Linux International is an organization that has been formed to promote the
wide spread adoption of the Linux Operating System amongst computer users
everywhere.  We in the organization believe that Linux provides potential
users with many advantages over rival operating systems (notably Microsoft's
Windows family and IBM's OS/2) and that many users would benefit from
installing and using Linux on their machines.  However there are currently
many obstacles preventing many users from utilizing Linux and taking full
advantage of its capabilities.  It is Linux International's goal to begin
removing these obstacles.

Essentially Linux International's goals are twofold:
- encourage as many people, organizations, and communities as possible to
  start using Linux
- promote the development and distribution of freely available software

Linux International will be doing whatever is reasonably possible to achieve
its goals.  As is evident though, much work remains to be done before
customers will see Linux as a viable solution to their operating system
requirements.  Most of the work though falls roughly into 3 categories:
	- Marketing
	- After sales service and support
	- Supplementary Research and Development

Marketing:
	It is pointless having the best operating system on the market and
presented at an affordable price point if you don't tell anyone about it. 
LI's role in this area will be to advertise Linux as far and as wide as
possible.  We will be emphasizing the many features and advantages that
Linux has to offer over its competition.  LI will be presenting solid
reasons to potential customers why they should switch from their present
operating environment to Linux.  LI will also be listening to customers
and taking note of their needs.  LI will then endeavor to make sure that
those needs are adequately addressed and that customers are happy with
present and future versions of Linux.

After Sales Service and Support
	This will be one of LI's biggest responsibilities - the establishment
of a suitable support infrastructure so that we can provide the desired
level of service to customers.  Support will be crucial (amongst other
things) in convincing customers to switch to Linux.  Support will be
primarily targeting the non-net community, ie those customers who do not
have access to the Internet and/or who cannot ask a friendly Unix guru to
freely install and maintain the Linux OS on their machines.

Supplementary Research and Development
	Work done in this area by LI will primarily be aimed at reducing the
complexity of the system for newbie users without compromising the
functionality of the system in any way.  This is required to not only reduce
the workload of the Customer Support department but also is required by
potential customers.  Other activities carried out by LI will be designed
to complement existing development work that is being carried out within
the Linux community.  Needless to say that all development work carried out
by LI will be freely released to the Linux community.

In addition LI will also be talking with third-party software developers and
encouraging them to port their software to Linux.  The availability of
software applications will also play a large part in Linux's success as a
future mainstream operating system.

We at LI believe that it is now time for Linux to begin taking on the big
boys in the industry.  Linux is truly capable of achieving this however
work needs to be done to provide the needed commercial services to back up
a solid product.  These global services will be orchestrated and managed by
Linux International.  We of course will be working closely with many
developers and assisting them in any way possible.  Together though, we are
going to ensure that Linux enjoys the level of success that is deserving of
such a fine operating system.  And we are going to ensure that Microsoft
and IBM aren't the only ones that can destroy an operating system ... err
... brilliantly market a superior OS to customers.

Regards,
Patrick D'Cruze			pdcr...@orac.iinet.com.au
Linux International

PS - Stay tuned for future announcements detailing a public mailing list and
a call for volunteers.

Disclaimer: Linux International in no way represents current or future Linux
developers.  The organization is a separate autonomous entity and speaks
only for itself.

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From: j...@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Joshua Konstadt)
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Linux International - What?
Date: 31 Mar 1994 09:01:49 GMT
Organization: Columbia University
Lines: 96
Message-ID: <2ne3ht$2ub@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: watsun.cc.columbia.edu

The following is a partial response to Linux International's posting
in c.o.l.a. I am only responding to a couple of things, so it's going
to be a little chopped up.

:Monday 28th March 1994:	An Introduction to Linux International
:
:We in the organization believe that Linux provides potential
:users with many advantages over rival operating systems (notably Microsoft's
:Windows family and IBM's OS/2) and that many users would benefit from
:installing and using Linux on their machines.

Is this a well thought out position? Is this Linux's target audience?
It seems rather inane to project Linux into this market. Let's be
blunt. Linux doesn't have Word for Windows or Lotus 123 - Doom's not
enough. It can't go head to head with these OS's right now. Whether as
a Un*x based OS it will ever compete is another debate entirely.

:However there are currently
:many obstacles preventing many users from utilizing Linux and taking full
:advantage of its capabilities.

Like a shrink-wrapped application base. Geez, it's like that was
some kind of mystery ...

:Essentially Linux International's goals are twofold:
:- encourage as many people, organizations, and communities as possible to
:  start using Linux

Are they ready? Does your average end-user have a need for Linux as of
yet? I think you better outline exactly what advantages Linux will
offer people, other than saying "but gee, it's such a great operating
system."

The word about Linux _is_ out in the kind of communities it benefits.
I don't what frontiers you're thinking of. Maybe you should be a
little more specific than just "people, organizations, and
communities." If you don't know who you intend to help, how can you
argue that your product is better?

:Linux International will be doing whatever is reasonably possible to achieve
:its goals. As is evident though, much work remains to be done before
:customers will see Linux as a viable solution to their operating system
:requirements.  Most of the work though falls roughly into 3 categories:
:	- Marketing
:	- After sales service and support
:	- Supplementary Research and Development

So that's it, huh? That's all Linux needs? I think you need to outline
a strategy here, not just break things down. Why would people want to
run Linux? Which people have those needs? How do you make that more
attractive to that group? Are you just kidding, or do you really
intend a full-frontal assualt on the shrink-wrap OS community (i.e.,
Windows, OS/2, etc.)

Frankly, I don't see the urgency in forcing Linux down the general
publics throat.  There's obviously a catch-22 here. The old which came
first - the app or the OS argument. And maybe you think that getting
Linux distributed is enough. Well, it may actually be detrimental.
First impressionas are lasting and all that.

There's a slew of new emulators and some such that _might_ change
Linux's future in that regard (ie.e, third-party support). It could be
like OS/2 as an integration platform, but that doesn't seem like it's
around the corner.

:Marketing:
:	It is pointless having the best operating system on the market and
:presented at an affordable price point if you don't tell anyone about it. 

And you have no apps to run on it.

:In addition LI will also be talking with third-party software developers and
:encouraging them to port their software to Linux.  The availability of
:software applications will also play a large part in Linux's success as a
:future mainstream operating system.

Wow. What a revelation. I hate to tell you guys, if you're targeting
Linux for the general community, availability of applications will be
PRIMARY to its acceptance.

:We at LI believe that it is now time for Linux to begin taking on the big
:boys in the industry.

Then you're in for a rude awakening. As a long term strategy, there
are some solid ideas here. But there's a whole bunch of stuff that
needs to go in the middle.

I don't really want to speculate on just exactly how much footwork has
to be done before you can acheive your rather lofty goals. I just
doubt very strongly that Linux is anywhere near to the task you have
given it.

Joshua Konstadt             :: This message is provided "as is" without
j...@columbia.edu           :: respect to warranties, implied or expressed.
                         
"Never let the facts get in the way of a witty post."

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From: ksore@atr-14 (Ken Sorensen)
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Linux International - What?
Date: 31 Mar 1994 16:47:11 GMT
Organization: Hughes Aircraft Company
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Joshua Konstadt (j...@watsun.cc.columbia.edu) wrote:
: The following is a partial response to Linux International's posting
: in c.o.l.a. I am only responding to a couple of things, so it's going
: to be a little chopped up.

: :Monday 28th March 1994:	An Introduction to Linux International
: :

[much heated disagreement deleted]

: Joshua Konstadt             :: This message is provided "as is" without
: j...@columbia.edu           :: respect to warranties, implied or expressed.
:                          
: "Never let the facts get in the way of a witty post."

C'mon..

..Give the folks some credit. Linux may never be as mainstream as DOS/Windows
but that doesn't mean that the general public should be excluded. However
there are a lot of developers and those that are Unix afficianados that
would love to get their hands on a free Unix, but may not realize that
Linux exists. This is an obvious area where Linux International could
break some ground.

True, they're gonna have a hell of a time convincing the mass-media,
mind-numbed masses that Linux is what they should run, but what would
it hurt if a few of them got into the fray. I, myself would like see
Linux take off and have it become a well-recognized alternative OS
for the PC market.

--
Kenneth Sorensen                    |  ks...@sed.hac.com
------------------------------------+----------------------------------
Hughes Aircraft Company             |  Phone: (714) 732-9816
P.O. Box 3310                       |  Fax:   (714) 732-1953
Fullerton, California, US           +----------------------------------
92634-3310, Mail Station: 618/B223  |  #include <std-disclaimer.h>

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From: pdcr...@iinet.com.au (Patrick D'Cruze)
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Linux International - What?
Date: 1 Apr 1994 02:30:18 +0800
Organization: iiNET Technologies
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j...@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Joshua Konstadt) writes:

>:
>:We in the organization believe that Linux provides potential
>:users with many advantages over rival operating systems (notably Microsoft's
>:Windows family and IBM's OS/2) and that many users would benefit from
>:installing and using Linux on their machines.

>Is this a well thought out position? Is this Linux's target audience?
>It seems rather inane to project Linux into this market. Let's be
>blunt. Linux doesn't have Word for Windows or Lotus 123 - Doom's not
>enough. It can't go head to head with these OS's right now. Whether as
>a Un*x based OS it will ever compete is another debate entirely.

>:However there are currently
>:many obstacles preventing many users from utilizing Linux and taking full
>:advantage of its capabilities.

>Like a shrink-wrapped application base. Geez, it's like that was
>some kind of mystery ...

As is evident to most everyone on this newsgroup and everyone within
Linux International, the availability of third-party software applications
will be crucial in our attempts to spread Linux to a wider user-base.
You are not alone in acknowledging the need for shrink-wrapped
applications and in fact, LI has been working solidly over the past
few months in this area.  Just to demonstrate just how seriously we
are taking this, we have contacted over 50 software companies in the
past 2 weeks alone, encouraging them to port and write native software
for Linux.  And we will probably contact at least that number
again in the next fortnight.  Yes, Joshua, we are well aware of
this problem and are working hard at it.

>:Essentially Linux International's goals are twofold:
>:- encourage as many people, organizations, and communities as possible to
>:  start using Linux

>Are they ready? Does your average end-user have a need for Linux as of
>yet? I think you better outline exactly what advantages Linux will
>offer people, other than saying "but gee, it's such a great operating
>system."

>The word about Linux _is_ out in the kind of communities it benefits.
>I don't what frontiers you're thinking of. Maybe you should be a
>little more specific than just "people, organizations, and
>communities." If you don't know who you intend to help, how can you
>argue that your product is better?

The intro posted to comp.os.linux.announce was just that - an introduction.
Surely we cannot be expected to reasonably cover everything in
detail in an intro posting.  For your information though, we do have
futher detailed information on everything that was covered in the intro
and will probably be making quite a lot of this available to anyone
who wants to subscribe to the mailing lists (when they're finally up
and running).

>:Linux International will be doing whatever is reasonably possible to achieve
>:its goals. As is evident though, much work remains to be done before
>:customers will see Linux as a viable solution to their operating system
>:requirements.  Most of the work though falls roughly into 3 categories:
>:	- Marketing
>:	- After sales service and support
>:	- Supplementary Research and Development

>So that's it, huh? That's all Linux needs? I think you need to outline
>a strategy here, not just break things down. Why would people want to
>run Linux? Which people have those needs? How do you make that more
>attractive to that group? Are you just kidding, or do you really
>intend a full-frontal assualt on the shrink-wrap OS community (i.e.,
>Windows, OS/2, etc.)

Well those questions are a reasonable start.  Believe me, there are
far more questions that need to be answered than this.
And yes, we are well aware of these questions.  However our
decision to leave out these questions and answers allowed us to
reduce the size of our announcement on c.o.l.a from 30 pages down to
about 4 (for which I think most people are grateful).

>Frankly, I don't see the urgency in forcing Linux down the general
>publics throat.  There's obviously a catch-22 here. The old which came
>first - the app or the OS argument. And maybe you think that getting
>Linux distributed is enough. Well, it may actually be detrimental.
>First impressionas are lasting and all that.

Believe me, we are well aware of all the hurdles, difficulties,
and risks involved.  We're not going in to this with our eyes closed.

>:Marketing:
>:	It is pointless having the best operating system on the market and
>:presented at an affordable price point if you don't tell anyone about it. 

>And you have no apps to run on it.

Thanks for pointing that out again :-)

>:In addition LI will also be talking with third-party software developers and
>:encouraging them to port their software to Linux.  The availability of
>:software applications will also play a large part in Linux's success as a
>:future mainstream operating system.

>Wow. What a revelation. I hate to tell you guys, if you're targeting
>Linux for the general community, availability of applications will be
>PRIMARY to its acceptance.

And again. :-)

>Then you're in for a rude awakening. As a long term strategy, there
>are some solid ideas here. But there's a whole bunch of stuff that
>needs to go in the middle.

>I don't really want to speculate on just exactly how much footwork has
>to be done before you can acheive your rather lofty goals. I just
>doubt very strongly that Linux is anywhere near to the task you have
>given it.

>Joshua Konstadt             :: This message is provided "as is" without
>j...@columbia.edu           :: respect to warranties, implied or expressed.
>                         
>"Never let the facts get in the way of a witty post."

While I have tried to remain as diplomatic as possible, I would appreciate
that in future, posters might like to credit us with a little bit more
intelligence.  If people would like to discuss views on potential
marketing strategies, target markets, etc then please contact us and we'll
gladly discuss it with you.  Similarly if you'd like to volunteer
your time and debate some of these issues I'd ask you to patiently
wait a short while longer until the mailing lists are set up (note this is
not an attempt to stifle debate on LI per se).  It would just be
nice if posters wouldn't automatically assume that we are all
brain-dead here at LI and that we haven't thought of any of this ourselves.
Apologies if this offends anyone.

Regards,
Patrick D'Cruze				pdcr...@orac.iinet.com.au
Linux International

Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.misc
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From: li...@fylz.com (Linux Journal)
Subject: Re: Linux International - What?
References: <2ne3ht$2ub@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu> <2neuqf$l2g@hacgate2.hac.com>
Organization: Linux Journal
Date: Sat, 2 Apr 1994 16:35:50 GMT
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Message-ID: <1994Apr2.163550.20293@fylz.com>
Lines: 56

Ken Sorensen (ksore@atr-14) wrote:

: ..Give the folks some credit. Linux may never be as mainstream as DOS/Windows
: but that doesn't mean that the general public should be excluded. However
: there are a lot of developers and those that are Unix afficianados that
: would love to get their hands on a free Unix, but may not realize that
: Linux exists. This is an obvious area where Linux International could
: break some ground.

This "general public" is one of the major reasons Linux Journal exists.
Not everyone is on the Internet (yet).  As we ramp up our newsstand
distribution we expect to bring a lot more people into the Linux camp.
(The other major reason, by the way, is that LJ has a better
signal-to-noise ration than these newsgroups. :-) )

: True, they're gonna have a hell of a time convincing the mass-media,
: mind-numbed masses that Linux is what they should run, but what would
: it hurt if a few of them got into the fray. I, myself would like see
: Linux take off and have it become a well-recognized alternative OS
: for the PC market.

This was what I originally thought but from talking to Linux users and
lots of people at Uniforum it may not be the case.  There is clearly the
group of people that we see here -- computer-literate Internet users but
there is another big group of Linux users that I don't think any of us
expected to see.  These are the "application users" who don't even know
what a Linux is.  Right now most of the ones I have heard about are
running a single application that was ported to Linux.

The reason these people exist is that hardware is cheap, the OS is cheap
and someone figured out that running the application under Linux instead
of DOS/Windoze would give the user better performance (and/or it was
easier to port).  One of the advertisers in Linux Journal sells a
commercial package.  It exists on other platforms such as HP.  I asked
them why they ported it to Linux and they said "customer requests".

I talked to another software vendor about Linux.  (They were aware of it
and had considered porting their software but I "moved it up on their
priority list.)  In their case I suggested that they put there software
and a Linux distribution on a CD-ROM.  Thus, the customer could buy the
whole solution including the operating system in one package and they
would be sure that their product worked with the version of Linux the
customer had.  They really liked this idea.

In conclusion, Linux is real and whether it is Linux International, Linux
Journal or individuals talking we basically have two tasks:
  - make people aware of Linux
  - show them how it can solve their problems
Once we do that it becomes an easy sell to get someone to use something
that costs less and works better.

    ++ Phil Hughes, Editor
-- 
Linux Journal -- The magazine of, for and about the Linux Community
P.O. Box 85867, Seattle, WA 98145-1867 USA
E-mail: li...@fylz.com   Phone: +1 206 524 8338 FAX: +1 206 526 0803