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utah-gr!crum
From: c...@utah-gr.UUCP (Gary L Crum)
Newsgroups: net.micro.mac
Subject: mac-compatible design technique
Message-ID: <1259@utah-gr.UUCP>
Date: Sun, 2-Dec-84 17:29:01 EST
Article-I.D.: utah-gr.1259
Posted: Sun Dec  2 17:29:01 1984
Date-Received: Wed, 5-Dec-84 00:55:04 EST
Organization: Univ of Utah CS Dept
Lines: 27

Is it legal to copy the Mac ROM data onto a diskette?  If so, perhaps a
'leach' technique could be used by a mac-compatible machine.

First, the buyer of the mac-compatible could be provided with a program
which would save the ROM routines (all 64K) on the provided disk.  This would
be a one-time operation for the customer.

Second, a mac-emulator program could then be run on the mac-compatible which
would load the ROM routines into a 'special' section of RAM that could sub-
sequently be write-protected (virtual ROM, if you will).  One might think of
the emulator disk as a 'MacWorks' for the proposed mac-compatible machine.

Oh, yes, the Macintosh is able to access its ROM faster than its RAM.  If
equal (or superior) performance is desired, then the clock rate of the mac-
compatible could be boosted (and the 68000-10 could be used, if necessary).

Once again, my original question:  Is it legal to copy the Mac ROM data onto
a diskette?  (The data would *not* be packaged with the machine; the customer
could merely find a friend's mac to get the data from)

Also, has anyone thought about designing a replacement-board for the Mac which
would upgrade the data bus lines to 32-bits (for the 68020, of course)?

		Thanks,
				Gary L. Crum
				c...@utah-cs.arpa
				c...@utah-cs.UUCP

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Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!amd!jimb
From: j...@amd.UUCP (Jim Budler)
Newsgroups: net.micro.mac
Subject: Re: mac-compatible design technique
Message-ID: <693@amd.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 4-Dec-84 10:54:46 EST
Article-I.D.: amd.693
Posted: Tue Dec  4 10:54:46 1984
Date-Received: Wed, 5-Dec-84 00:32:59 EST
References: <>
Reply-To: j...@amd.UUCP (Jim Budler)
Organization: AMD Applications, Santa Clara, CA
Lines: 17
Summary: 

In article <> c...@utah-gr.UUCP (Gary L Crum) writes:
>......
>Once again, my original question:  Is it legal to copy the Mac ROM data onto
>a diskette?  (The data would *not* be packaged with the machine; the customer
>could merely find a friend's mac to get the data from)
>
>
All you have done is changed the illegal act from the manufacturer
of the clone to the individual purchasers, perhaps making it more
difficult for apple to prosecute but NOT more legal.
-- 
 Jim Budler
 Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.
 (408) 982-6547
 UUCPnet: {ucbvax,decwrl,ihnp4,allegra,intelca}!amd!jimb
 Compuserve:	72415,1200
 The Source:	STW265

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From: chu...@nsc.UUCP (Cheshire Chuqui)
Newsgroups: net.micro.mac
Subject: mac-compatible design technique
Message-ID: <1964@nsc.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 4-Dec-84 14:56:14 EST
Article-I.D.: nsc.1964
Posted: Tue Dec  4 14:56:14 1984
Date-Received: Wed, 5-Dec-84 01:07:20 EST
Organization: Plaid Heaven
Lines: 31

References <1...@utah-gr.UUCP>
Reply-To: chu...@nsc.UUCP (Cheshire Chuqui)
Distribution: 
Organization: Plaid Heaven
Keywords:
Summary:

 
>Is it legal to copy the Mac ROM data onto a diskette?  If so, perhaps a
>'leach' technique could be used by a mac-compatible machine.

This is, I believe, called stealing. Last I looked, stealing wasn't legal.

Two precedents-- Apple vs. Franklin Computer over the Franklin clones
borrowing Apple's software (Franklin lost) and Microsoft vs. Advanced Logic
Systems over ALS's CPM board for the Apple-- ALS 'borrowed' the boot proms
from the Microsoft CP/M card and got caught (the programmers initials were
hidden in a documented but not obvious position-- interesting proof). The
mac roms are proprietary and I'm sure that they are covered by copyright,
at least. Any Mac compatible that attempts to use them without licensing
the technology from apple will find themselves in deep trouble, and Apple
will be more than happy to jump on them (justifiably so-- the development
costs in those rams are enormous). 

chuq
-- 
From the center of a Plaid pentagram:		Chuq Von Rospach
{cbosgd,decwrl,fortune,hplabs,ihnp4,seismo}!nsc!chuqui  nsc!chu...@decwrl.ARPA

  ~But you know, monsieur, that as long as she wears the claw of the dragon
  upon her breast you can do nothing-- her soul belongs to me!~

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sun!qubix!msc
From: m...@qubix.UUCP (Mark Callow)
Newsgroups: net.micro.mac
Subject: Re: mac-compatible design technique
Message-ID: <1569@qubix.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 5-Dec-84 17:46:57 EST
Article-I.D.: qubix.1569
Posted: Wed Dec  5 17:46:57 1984
Date-Received: Sat, 8-Dec-84 04:53:33 EST
Organization: Qubix Graphic Systems, San Jose, CA
Lines: 12

References: <1964@nsc.UUCP>

> The mac roms are proprietary and I'm sure that they are covered by copyright,
> at least.
> 
> chuq

proprietary information and copyright are mutually exclusive.
-- 
From the TARDIS of Mark Callow
m...@qubix.UUCP,  qubix!...@decwrl.ARPA
...{decvax,ucbvax}!decwrl!qubix!msc, ...{amd,ihnp4,ittvax}!qubix!msc

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Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!amd!jimb
From: j...@amd.UUCP (Jim Budler)
Newsgroups: net.micro.mac
Subject: Re: mac-compatible design technique
Message-ID: <700@amd.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 6-Dec-84 12:37:30 EST
Article-I.D.: amd.700
Posted: Thu Dec  6 12:37:30 1984
Date-Received: Fri, 7-Dec-84 01:56:24 EST
References: <>
Reply-To: j...@amd.UUCP (Jim Budler)
Organization: AMD Applications, Santa Clara, CA
Lines: 26
Summary: 

In article <> m...@qubix.UUCP (Mark Callow) writes:
>References: <1...@nsc.UUCP>
>
>> The mac roms are proprietary and I'm sure that they are covered by copyright,
>> at least.
>> 
>> chuq
>
>proprietary information and copyright are mutually exclusive.
>-- 
You must be confusing proprietary information with trade secrets. 
Proprietary means property.  That's all it means.  

Copyrighted means the right to copy an article is governed by the
laws of the United States.

You will very often find copyrighted proprietary information.

Try the source code for Unix.
-- 
 Jim Budler
 Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.
 (408) 982-6547
 UUCPnet: {ucbvax,decwrl,ihnp4,allegra,intelca}!amd!jimb
 Compuserve:	72415,1200
 The Source:	STW265

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Path: utzoo!henry
From: he...@utzoo.UUCP (Henry Spencer)
Newsgroups: net.micro.mac
Subject: Re: mac-compatible design technique
Message-ID: <4745@utzoo.UUCP>
Date: Fri, 7-Dec-84 19:38:10 EST
Article-I.D.: utzoo.4745
Posted: Fri Dec  7 19:38:10 1984
Date-Received: Fri, 7-Dec-84 19:38:10 EST
References: <700@amd.UUCP>
Organization: U of Toronto Zoology
Lines: 11

> You will very often find copyrighted proprietary information.
>
> Try the source code for Unix.

Not so!  Unix source code hasn't carried copyright notices for a long
time.  Why?  Because copyright implies *publication*, and is -- more or
less, roughly speaking -- incompatible with trade-secret protection,
which is how Unix innards are protected.
-- 
				Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
				{allegra,ihnp4,linus,decvax}!utzoo!henry