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Path: utzoo!utgpu!water!watmath!clyde!att!rutgers!gatech!ken
From: k...@gatech.edu (Ken Seefried iii)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.aux
Subject: Will there be a release 3 AUX
Message-ID: <17331@gatech.edu>
Date: 29 Jul 88 23:40:09 GMT
Organization: School of Information and Computer Science, Georgia Tech, Atlanta
Lines: 13

When will there be an AUX release  based on System V  release 3 (or 4)?

Are there plans to produce an AUX like SunOS 4 (no flames), meaning
a System V/BSD merge?

thanks...


	ken seefried iii	...!{akgua, allegra, amd, harpo, hplabs, 
	k...@gatech.edu		inhp4, masscomp, rlgvax, sb1, uf-cgrl, 
	ccas...@gitvm1.bitnet	unmvax, ut-ngp, ut-sally}!gatech!ken

	soon to be open: ...!gatech!spooge!ken (finally ;'})

Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!lll-winken!lll-tis!ames!amdahl!apple!phil
From: p...@Apple.COM (Phil Ronzone)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.aux
Subject: Re: Will there be a release 3 AUX
Message-ID: <15011@apple.Apple.COM>
Date: 1 Aug 88 17:21:56 GMT
References: <17331@gatech.edu>
Reply-To: p...@apple.apple.com.UUCP (Phil Ronzone)
Organization: Apple Computer A/UX Group
Lines: 15

In article <17...@gatech.edu> k...@gatech.edu (Ken Seefried iii) writes:
>...
>Are there plans to produce an AUX like SunOS 4 (no flames), meaning
>a System V/BSD merge?

Umm - well, we are never going to produce an "A/UX like SunOs 4". We
couldn't stand the loss of functionality! nasty :-) ... but we are a
SVR2 with excellent BSD functionality. Something that OS4 is still not
near. The politically correct question is when will SunOS 4 be as nice
as the "merge" as A/UX 1.0???
-----------------------
Philip K. Ronzone  A/UX System Architect
Apple Computer MS 27AJ 10500 N. DeAnza Blvd. Cupertino CA 95014
{amdahl,decwrl,sun,voder,nsc,mtxinu,dual,unisoft}!apple!phil
"In A/UX Release 4.0, /bin will still be there ...." P. Zigbooli

Path: utzoo!utgpu!water!watmath!clyde!att!osu-cis!tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!
rutgers!gatech!ken
From: k...@gatech.edu (Ken Seefried iii)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.aux
Subject: Re: Will there be a release 3 AUX
Message-ID: <17334@gatech.edu>
Date: 1 Aug 88 19:25:59 GMT
References: <17331@gatech.edu> <15011@apple.Apple.COM>
Reply-To: k...@gatech.UUCP (Ken Seefried iii)
Organization: School of Information and Computer Science, Georgia Tech, Atlanta
Lines: 42

In article <15...@apple.Apple.COM> p...@apple.apple.com.UUCP (Phil Ronzone) 
writes:
>In article <17...@gatech.edu> k...@gatech.edu (Ken Seefried iii) writes:
>>...
>>Are there plans to produce an AUX like SunOS 4 (no flames), meaning
>>a System V/BSD merge?
>
>Umm - well, we are never going to produce an "A/UX like SunOs 4". We
>couldn't stand the loss of functionality! nasty :-) ... but we are a
>SVR2 with excellent BSD functionality. Something that OS4 is still not
>near. The politically correct question is when will SunOS 4 be as nice
>as the "merge" as A/UX 1.0???
>-----------------------
>Philip K. Ronzone  A/UX System Architect
>Apple Computer MS 27AJ 10500 N. DeAnza Blvd. Cupertino CA 95014

This is why i asked for no flames...

I do not in any way, shape or form consider this an answer to my question.
You are correct that SunOS 4 is not "SVR2 with excellent BSD functionality",
it is BSD4.3 with most of SV release *3*.  Sun has provided an order
of magnitude richer programming environment than Apple.  The only thing 
A/UX has is (for now) it is less buggy, though not vastly less.  SunOS
4.1 should be very clean.  Oh, and it also runs on SPARC and the 80386
in addition to the 68010/68020.

I love Apple products.  I want to buy Apple products.  But i need Unix to
do my work.  I need to know that Apple has a deep commitment to Unix.
I don't seem to be a able to get that.  

I restate ( in different words ) my original question:

	When will i see System V release 3 based A/UX?
	When will i see full Berkeley integration?

I won't even ask for things like lightweight processes, which Sun gives me.

DISCLAIMER: i have no affiliation with either Sun or Apple.


	ken seefried iii	...!{akgua, allegra, amd, harpo, hplabs, 
	k...@gatech.edu		inhp4, masscomp, rlgvax, sb1, uf-cgrl, 
	ccas...@gitvm1.bitnet	unmvax, ut-ngp, ut-sally}!gatech!ken

Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!lll-winken!lll-tis!helios.ee.lbl.gov!pasteur!
ucbvax!decwrl!labrea!rutgers!att!whuts!mhuxh!mhuxu!mls
From: m...@mhuxu.UUCP (Michael Siemon)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.aux
Subject: Re: Will there be a release 3 AUX
Summary: wrong answer
Message-ID: <7903@mhuxu.UUCP>
Date: 2 Aug 88 14:10:29 GMT
References: <17331@gatech.edu> <15011@apple.Apple.COM>
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Murray Hill
Lines: 18

In article <15...@apple.Apple.COM>, p...@Apple.COM (Phil Ronzone) writes:

> Umm - well, we are never going to produce an "A/UX like SunOs 4". We
> couldn't stand the loss of functionality! nasty :-) ... but we are a
> SVR2 with excellent BSD functionality. Something that OS4 is still not
> near. The politically correct question is when will SunOS 4 be as nice
> as the "merge" as A/UX 1.0???

This response is not constructive.  What needs to be known, quite aside
from issues of how much like/unlike SunOS A/UX will be, is whether, for
example, streams and other V.3 features will be supported, and whether
Apple intends to track (in some way, I'm not prejudging the way) the ongoing
efforts to reconverge the various flavors of unices.  "Politically correct
questions" be damned.
-- 
Michael L. Siemon
contracted to AT&T Bell Laboratories
ihnp4!mhuxu!mls
standard disclaimer

Path: utzoo!utgpu!attcan!uunet!husc6!bloom-beacon!apple!phil
From: p...@Apple.COM (Phil Ronzone)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.aux
Subject: Re: Will there be a release 3 AUX
Message-ID: <15131@apple.Apple.COM>
Date: 3 Aug 88 17:52:56 GMT
References: <17331@gatech.edu> <15011@apple.Apple.COM> <7903@mhuxu.UUCP>
Reply-To: p...@apple.apple.com.UUCP (Phil Ronzone)
Organization: Apple Computer A/UX Group
Lines: 47

In article <7...@mhuxu.UUCP> m...@mhuxu.UUCP (Michael Siemon) writes:
>This response is not constructive.  What needs to be known, quite aside
>from issues of how much like/unlike SunOS A/UX will be, is whether, for
>example, streams and other V.3 features will be supported, and whether
>Apple intends to track (in some way, I'm not prejudging the way) the ongoing
>efforts to reconverge the various flavors of unices.  "Politically correct
>questions" be damned.

Actually Michael, you desire to know these things is quite reasonable. This
has just been a irritating week for me since I'm debugging some new Toolbox
programs under A/UX. I get irritated when debugging :-)

My response was moderate sarcastic to the flames from people who OBVIOUSLY
have not used/RTFM'd the product at all. For example, I have been "told"
that A/UX does not have STREAMS, isn't a "UNIX" somehow (i.e., when we Apple
do a "real" (???) UNIX, and been told something that ain't true on UNIX
licensing. The best was the stated fact that A/UX has "no Toolbox support
whatsoever"!!! This greatly surprised me and caused me to look in
wonderment at MacDraw II running on A/UX 1.0. (very sarcastic symbol here)

Some of our sensitivity goes back to a "well know UNIX magazine" that blasted
us in an editorial about how bad our product was. The editorial admitted that
they had NOT seen the product -- in fact, the blast seemed to be that the
UNIX press was left out on the Mac II introduction sneaks.

Anyway - I'm sure the blasts and flames and non-RTFM boze's we get aren't
one whit different than happens to SUN/Apolo/DEC ...

Now for the obligatory information ( :-) ) --

We are a real UNIX. If somebody disagrees, give us concrete examples, not
just "it ain't real UNIX". We are SVR2.2 based. Our TCP/IP code and NFS is
the same you see on VAXen and SUNs. We will remain SVR2+++ based for
about a year. We expect & assume (BUT NO PROMISES) to jump to SVR4. In the
meantime, you will see X11.2 and POSIX "REAL SOON NOW" -- next 2-3 quarters.
Some Universities and other public forums have seen the demos of this. And
we plan on ever-expanding the Toolbox support under A/UX. And of course
we will track the ongoing releases on NFS and YP and TCP/IP and so on.

Suggestions and comments solicited. Those suggestions and comments based
on actual use of A/UX will be listened to ... :-) :-)
-------------------------------
Philip K. Ronzone  A/UX System Architect
Apple Computer MS 27AJ 10500 N. DeAnza Blvd. Cupertino CA 95014
{amdahl,decwrl,sun,voder,nsc,mtxinu,dual,unisoft}!apple!phil
"In A/UX Release 4.0, /bin will still be there ...." P. Zigbooli

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