Path: gmdzi!unido!mcsun!uunet!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!usc!apple!apple.com!bc From: b...@apple.com (bill coderre) Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.misc,comp.sys.mac.system Subject: Respectfully submitted, an etiquette guide Message-ID: <56997@apple.Apple.COM> Date: 6 Sep 91 00:09:41 GMT Sender: b...@Apple.COM Organization: Apple Computer Inc, Cupertino, CA Lines: 26 Xref: gmdzi comp.sys.mac.misc:63171 comp.sys.mac.system:8565 Let's say you go to a party. You: a) demand that all h'ors d'oeuvres be brought to the door for your inspection b) go over to the food table and check it out. After you scope the grub, you: a) announce loudly that there are no cheese balls b) politely inform the host of your dietary requirements, and ask what might be available to suit you When no cheeseballs are forthcoming, you: a) demand meat-free, low-cholesterol snacks immediately and loudly b) seek other food you might eat If the host informs you that there are no foods that meet your needs, you: a) accuse him and the caterers of malicious negligence b) tell him that you'd love to make some suggestions for future parties If some guests seem irritated at your behavior, you: a) accuse everyone in earshot of being a "toady" b) apologize for your disturbance and try to have fun at the party. If you need more clues than this, drop me a line. I'll be glad to elucidate. bill coderre more interested in spending his "copious free time" helping peopl
Path: gmdzi!unido!unidui!math.fu-berlin.de!fauern!ira.uka.de! sol.ctr.columbia.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!infoserv! infoserv.com!erics From: er...@infoserv.com (Eric S. Smith) Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.misc,comp.sys.mac.system Subject: Re: Respectfully submitted, an etiquette guide Message-ID: <D2150056.o4d4fu@erics.infoserv.com> Date: 8 Sep 91 06:22:45 GMT Reply-To: er...@infoserv.com Organization: Van Epps-Smith Enterprises Lines: 21 Xref: gmdzi comp.sys.mac.misc:63324 comp.sys.mac.system:8709 X-Mailer: uAccess - Mac Release: 1.5 Bill, Have your recent posts had any purpose except to express wounded indignation over some comments people have made about Apple? It seems to me that some people have legitimate concerns but you can't see past the fact that they express these concerns in a way that you don't like. I don't think your sarcastic replies and posts are doing anything to promote Apple's image, at least not with me. > bill coderre > more interested in spending his "copious free time" helping peopl I hope that's true; I haven't seen any of it here recently. ----- Eric Smith | "We must welcome the future, remembering that er...@sco.com | soon it will be the past; and we must respect er...@infoserv.com | the past, remembering that once it was all CI$: 70262,3610 | that was humanly possible." -- George Santayana
Path: gmdzi!unido!unidui!math.fu-berlin.de!fauern!ira.uka.de! sol.ctr.columbia.edu!samsung!olivea!apple!bc From: b...@Apple.COM (bill coderre) Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.misc,comp.sys.mac.system Subject: Re: Respectfully submitted, an etiquette guide Message-ID: <57150@apple.Apple.COM> Date: 10 Sep 91 18:34:04 GMT References: <D2150056.o4d4fu@erics.infoserv.com> Organization: Apple Computer Inc., Cupertino, CA Lines: 64 Xref: gmdzi comp.sys.mac.misc:63344 comp.sys.mac.system:8726 Eric Smith er...@infoserv.com writes: |Have your recent posts had any purpose except to express wounded indignation |over some comments people have made about Apple? |I don't think your sarcastic replies and posts are doing anything to promote |Apple's image, at least not with me. |> bill coderre |> more interested in spending his "copious free time" helping peopl |I hope that's true; I haven't seen any of it here recently. I'm sorry you're offended by the way I have been expressing my anger about recent Usenet posts. My posts were attempting to get people to realize that posting angry, fact-free and insinuation-filled tirades would not get them polite, fact-filled replies. Apparently, although I have been concentrating on fact-filled responses and avoiding insinuations, my anger has offended you and possibly others. I'm sorry about that. I would like to note, however, that for as long as I can remember, people have been flaming Apple and claiming that it doesn't care about its customers. This is patently false. It also injures Apple's reputation, since many of the people who read these networks don't realize that unanswered claims are not necessarily factual. When I had the "gall" to try to answer these claims, I have been fought tooth and nail by a very vocal, tiny minority of the people who post. (I have also received literally dozens of letters of support from readers, but this is not directly germane to this point...) When I provided documentable facts of Apple's caring -- public commitments to caring, strong upgrade programs, long support of machines no longer made, even free software to correct problems -- the arguments dissolved to name calling (cf. a recent article that calls me "dilluded [sic]") and semantics (cf. a recent thread that claims that Apple as a company doesn't care, even though people working there do). Isn't it funny that none of these claims about Apple's lack of compassion has held up even to cursory examination of the facts? bill coderre ps. Your claim that I do nothing to help users is also false. I have sent over three dozen emails to Apple customers in the last few days alone. You obviously didn't know that. In addition, I was the one who PUT MY JOB ON THE LINE by encouraging people to write to the Apple Customer Assistance Center and ask for a solution to the 32-bit problem. It's a measure of my faith in Apple that I took a risk that at other companies it would have gotten me fired. As a result of this 32-bit nightmare, Apple is strengthening its commitment to customers -- the ACAC seems to be becoming an "ombudsman agency" (ie. a customer advocate, if you will) that will fight for the needs of users and be able to make changes. Anyone who in light of this still claims that Apple couldn't care less about its customers is just foolish. In the future, I will try to stay out of these flame wars, though, since it detracts from my ability to help customers.