While you guys were living it up at Share.

Cory Hamasaki

Mar 8, 2001

I was working here in DeeCee. IBM is pitching a z/900 to a client and I
got to sit in the back of the room.

The presentation was IBM smooth, I got the handouts, "For the next
generation of e-business", a copy of the z Redbook, and a chance to talk
to their presenter.

I mentioned that I was interested in running z at home and he
immediately brought up Flex. We talked about it, I told him that I was
running MVS/370 3.8 on an OPEN/370 and was familiar with the benefits of
FSI's product. IBM is pitching Flex as if it is an IBM product, at
least that's my impression. He said, "We have this offering ..."

I told him about H/390, how z support was in place, perhaps not shaken
down but H/390 is able to run OS/390.

I asked him about hobby licenses, pressing z on CD and handing it out
and here's where it gets sureal.

He understood the point. We looked at each other, saying very little.

He said, "We gotta build mind-share. This would help."

"We've got the best hardware, reliable, powerful, well developed."

"We've got S/390 back in some universities, they run Linux/390 on it.
The web hosting companies love it, you don't need racks of hardware."

I think, this is just my opinion, IBM needs H/390 more than H/390 needs
IBM.

There is no downside for IBM (or FSI).

Anywho, I've got the presenter's business card and thought I drop him an
email. Any thoughts?

-- OS's --

Is there a list of OS's on the web? What's available and what's
missing? I may have access to a repository of pre-OCO, pre-license
S/370 software.

-- New User Doc --

Any updates? I haven't badgered the list for a while but we need more
documentation. See http://www.kiyoinc.com/hercdoc.html for more
information on userdoc.

--

cory hamasaki

12:33 am


Re: While you guys were living it up at Share.

juergen.dobrinski@...

Mar 8, 2001

--- In hercules-390@y..., Cory Hamasaki <kiyoinc@a...> wrote:
>We talked about it, I told him that I was
> running MVS/370 3.8 on an OPEN/370 and was familiar with the
benefits of
> FSI's product.

Hello Cory,

as you are running OPEN/370 which (as far as I know) is the
predecessor of FLEX, do you know how it's "real" performance (not
just BCTR loops, but an IPL or SYSGEN etc) compares to Herc?

Juergen

8:27 pm


Re: While you guys were living it up at Share.

Cory Hamasaki

Mar 9, 2001

** Reply to note from Juergen 9 Mar 2001 10:17:35 -0000

> Hello Cory,
>
> as you are running OPEN/370 which (as far as I know) is the
> predecessor of FLEX, do you know how it's "real" performance (not
> just BCTR loops, but an IPL or SYSGEN etc) compares to Herc?
>
> Juergen

Yes, it's the FLEX predecessor.

I've run the BCTR looper and was disappointed with the numbers. I don't
recall them but 2-3 MIPS comes to mind. This is old unoptimized
software on an old P90 CPU.

The machine is more than a 370/158 but less than a 3032, two boxes that
I've used in the past.

IPL's take longer than 15 minutes. This is running MVS 3.8 and TSO. A
lot of the time, the machine waiting for me to set up the XTERMs,
respond to the console.

Coincidentally, IBM sent a snail-mail announcement yesterday for a new
Partners-in-S/390-development program. IBM is pushing a 17 MIPS FLEX-ES
as a small S/390 development platform, the tServer-D. See
http://www.t3t.com

US$ 850/month or $30,000 over 3 years.

The platform is a Netfinity server and IBM will "loan" copies of any IBM
OS to "partners".

The financial side of this "deal" is interesting. The $30,000 covers
the Netfinity box, t3t's integration, SCO's license, and Fundamental
Software's license.

IBM is pitching in marketing dollars and "loaner" copies of their
software. These companies are doing this to promote S/390. Sure, the
revenue stream is nice too.

Hercules promotes S/390. We should not think that we're second class
citizens in the S/390 world. Hercules/390 is the most exciting
development in S/390 in a long time. It compares to Linux/390 as
world-changers.

Here's some speculation -

I believe that within IBM, there are at least two independent
Hercules/390 development projects, they are probably not aware of each
other but we'll hear about them the way the Linux people learned about
Linux/390.

I believe that within 2 years, IBM Partners-in-S/390-Development will
distribute a Linux, Hercules, z/OS, press go and logon to TSO CD-set.

I believe that Hercules will be the standard for Linux/390 development
as opposed to hardware based S/390s.

I suspect that there will be an active program of migrating software
from z/OS to Linux/390 and back. Pure Linux software will migrate to
z/OS through Linux/390.

That's the speculation for the day. Here's the commercial -

We still need more articles on the web for new users, see

http://www.kiyoinc.com/hercdoc.html

--

cory hamasaki

12:53 pm


Re: While you guys were living it up at Share.

Volker Bandke

Mar 9, 2001

They also (will) offer a Thinkpad A21p with Flex/ES and the IBM AD/CD (if one
qualifies for the AD/CD) for USD $13000.

I am seriously tempted.....


With kind Regards |\ _,,,---,,_
ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,
Volker Bandke |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-'
(BSP GmbH) '---''(_/--' `-'\_)

Lesser known machine instructions - LD: Lose Device

(Another Wisdom from my fortune cookie jar)


-----Ursprungliche Nachricht-----
Von: Cory Hamasaki [mailto:kiyoinc@...]
Gesendet: Freitag, 9. Marz 2001 13:54
An: hercules-390@yahoogroups.com
Betreff: [hercules-390] Re: While you guys were living it up at Share.

<snipped>
Coincidentally, IBM sent a snail-mail announcement yesterday for a new
Partners-in-S/390-development program. IBM is pushing a 17 MIPS FLEX-ES
as a small S/390 development platform, the tServer-D. See
http://www.t3t.com

US$ 850/month or $30,000 over 3 years.

The platform is a Netfinity server and IBM will "loan" copies of any IBM
OS to "partners".
<snipping again>

4:54 pm


Re: While you guys were living it up at Share.

jim stephens

Mar 9, 2001

How does one sign up to be a "reseller" of these packages? So far all I have
seen are overpriced PC's bundled with the software by non-IBM resellers.

That is, I have seen no offering directly from IBM but rather from it's NUMA
resellers.

I'd like just the software, thank you, keep your $45000 PC's and I'll go for
this package in some form.

From the following, It sounds like the software is around $10000 or so,
maybe less, depending on what you value the Thinkpad at full list price.

Also, are there any flex users out there? Is there a possiblity of running
flex on something other than SCO (yuck!)

Jim

Volker Bandke wrote:

> They also (will) offer a Thinkpad A21p with Flex/ES and the IBM AD/CD (if one
> qualifies for the AD/CD) for USD $13000.
>
> I am seriously tempted.....
>

nice kitty

>
> With kind Regards |\ _,,,---,,_
> ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,
> Volker Bandke |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-'
> (BSP GmbH) '---''(_/--' `-'\_)

<snip>

5:09 pm


Re: While you guys were living it up at Share.

stuart@...

Mar 9, 2001

Jim:

I asked Peter Ward this very question several months back, and he
claimed it ran under Linux. So one day I called Flex, and spoke to
someone there. They had no idea what he was talking about in the way
of a Linux version!

As well, I checked their website, and last time I did, there was no
mention of a Linux version either. Although, I admit, I would think
something written to run under SCO (binaries) would in fact be able
to run under Linux amicably. Yet, I dont see it as a product!

Looks like Hercules wins again on that plane!

Stuart
Beverly Hills, CA
Unix Administrator (contractor)


--- In hercules-390@y..., jim stephens <jwstephens@h...> wrote:
> How does one sign up to be a "reseller" of these packages? So far
all I have
> seen are overpriced PC's bundled with the software by non-IBM
resellers.
>
> That is, I have seen no offering directly from IBM but rather from
it's NUMA
> resellers.
>
> I'd like just the software, thank you, keep your $45000 PC's and
I'll go for
> this package in some form.
>
> From the following, It sounds like the software is around $10000 or
so,
> maybe less, depending on what you value the Thinkpad at full list
price.
>
> Also, are there any flex users out there? Is there a possiblity of
running
> flex on something other than SCO (yuck!)
>
> Jim
>
> Volker Bandke wrote:
>
> > They also (will) offer a Thinkpad A21p with Flex/ES and the IBM
AD/CD (if one
> > qualifies for the AD/CD) for USD $13000.
> >
> > I am seriously tempted.....
> >
>
> nice kitty
>
> >
> > With kind Regards |\ _,,,---,,_
> > ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,
> > Volker Bandke |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-'
> > (BSP GmbH) '---''(_/--' `-'\_)
>
> <snip>

5:47 pm


Re: While you guys were living it up at Share.

Jay Maynard

Mar 9, 2001

On Fri, Mar 09, 2001 at 05:47:00PM -0000, stuart@... wrote:
> I asked Peter Ward this very question several months back, and he
> claimed it ran under Linux. So one day I called Flex, and spoke to
> someone there. They had no idea what he was talking about in the way
> of a Linux version!

FSI was demonstrating Flex-ES on a ThinkPad under Red Hat 7 at SHARE. The
sales guy I spoke to about it said that they normally only use Linux on
laptops because of its superior support for laptop hardware compared to SCO.

5:50 pm


Copyright 2001