Freakin' IBM...

BruceTSmith

Jun 10, 2008

I see we've got some comments on IBM legal stuff today. I really
don't know where to start...

I guess I can see what they're "afraid of". Some clown goes out and
buys a couple racks worth of "Hercules Servers", instead of real IBM
iron, and tries to setup a "production environment". I guess they're
"afraid" that somebody could make some money using IBM software,
without paying for the license, without buying IBM hardware to do it on...

But is that a real concern? After all, what makes big iron what it is
are things like dozens of fibre channels. Now I know that Hercules can
get some pretty nice MIPS out of a modern x86 chip, and some pretty
good I/O rates. But there is no way in hell that a poor PC can keep up
with the data that a 16 channel Shark disk array can provide, for
example. Maybe Hercules can supply a pretty quick environment for a
single user, but has anybody ever actually tried to run a "production
system" under Hercules? Something like a half dozen batch jobs, and
maybe a hundred CICS users on-line, at the same time? Maybe I'm wrong,
but I don't think Herc will cut it, when it comes to an "acceptable
reponse time"...

I think there are around 4 types of people that are intereted in
Hercules, and the related OSes...

First is the "greedy schmuck", the guy that does want to use IBM
software, to make money, without paying for it. I say screw them, I've
got no problem with IBM sending their entire legal team after these
jerks...

Second, are the active mainframe programmers, the guys that do work on
real iron every day. Legal, licensed users. That's me, I'm a systems
programmer, I've got a z/800 at work, runs z/VSE-4.1 . Now, I've got a
T1 at work, and cable at home. I can sit at home, fire up the VPN,
crank up my (paid for) copy of the IBM P-Comm 3270 emulator, and I can
do anything from my den, that I can do from my desk at work, where I'm
25 feet from the real iron, and I swear it's just as fast. Well,
anything except maybe re-IPL, or mount a tape, but with
who-knows-how-many terrabytes of Shark disk space, I can load anything
I may need when I am at the office. We don't need no stinkin' tapes... :)

But I can't "run" z/VSE on my home computer? Heck, I can upload source
code from my home PC, compile / assemble it, CEMT NEW it, and run my
latest and greatest version of that CICS program from home. But I
can't "run" CICS on my home PC? Does IBM really have a problem with
us? Yea, maybe my company is making money, but we are also paying the
license fee, we did buy the hardware. Anything that I may do at home,
will only end up on real iron in the end. Who knows, maybe some day
I'll develop some kool "showcase" piece of software at home, that will
really show off that fancy new z at work. Shouldn't IBM be encourging
such behavior???

Third, is the group that I hope to move to in a few years, the old,
retired farts. Yup, I've been doing S/3x0 for 40 years. I don't know,
maybe I'm strange, but computers have been way more than just a job in
my life, they've also always been my favorite hobby. Back before the
"PC" was even a pipe dream, I'ld do my "8 hours" at work, then hang
around the computer room, begging to sneak in a quick compile.
Computers were, computers are, "fun", and the System/3x0 is a really
"fun" box to play with. IBM, of all people, should know this... If /
when I actually do "retire", I'ld love to be able to continue
"playing" with the 3x0. I'm not looking to "make money", I just want
to do what I've always loved to do...

Hey, in my "old age", when I've got "nothing else to do", who knows, I
may start hanging around places like "developer" sites. Experience is
something that only time can buy. Now listen IBM, wouldn't it be nice
to have someone with 50 years (by then) of mainframe experience,
hanging around one of YOUR programmer sites, offering "FREE" ideas,
advice, help, to those that are currently programming YOUR computers?
Oh well, see my next topic on students, I guess...

You know, IBM, if it wasn't for us old geeks, some could wonder if you
would even be in the position that you are today. Where would you be
if us old timers didn't write those millions, heck, billions of lines
of custom COBOL, and RPG, and Assembly, and /CICS code? Yea, maybe
you'ld have a couple great OSes, but what would you be doing with
them??? I have given you my life, IBM, and I plan to give you the rest
of my life, until the day I drop dead. I don't want to rip anybody
off, but I think you owe me... :)

And fourth, is the student population. Now, I've really tried to think
of a better word to describe it, but stupid is the only thing I can
come up with. Here are who-knows-how-many people, that want to learn
the architecture, that want to become mainframe programmers, that want
to help promote the hardware. These are the people that will continue
the hugely successful 45 year history of the mainframe, and what is
IBM is saying to them? Is their any other word, but rock-hard stupid???

I'm gettin' tired, I could go on for hours. These days, IBM is a "huge
supporter" of open source software. How many million have they
invested in Linux? Yea, they've made many more millions in "Linux
hardware", but the fact is that they are a promoter of Linux in a big
way. Come on IBM, give us a break, open up the other OSes. What are
you "afraid" of, the active SysProgs that keep your real iron up
today, the old geezer that just wants to have some "fun", the
student??? ??? Maybe I'll live to see it, I should be so lucky... :)

I'll be the first to sign a "not for profit" license. If you want to
keep the latest and greatest z operating systems closed, IBM, that's
fine, I understand. I'm not asking for free use of VSE-4.1 (even
though I do have the CD). Something like the 20 year old VSE/SP would
be just fine. I've got those install tapes around here somewhere...

I only wish I could share them with the Hercules community..

I'm outta here, for now...

:)

4:22 am

Re: Freakin' IBM...

Enrico Sorichetti

Jun 12, 2008

--- In hercules-390@yahoogroups.com, "BruceTSmith" <brucetsmith@...> wrote:
>
> ref too many...

THE ISSUE IS NOT HERCULES RELATED
can You gentleman be so kind take the tread somewhere
ADVOCACY might be the best place
or somebody activate a SOAPBOX forum

thank You for the courtesy
regards
enrico sorichetti

4:19 pm

RE: [hercules-390] Re: Freakin' IBM...

Gregg C Levine

Jun 12, 2008

Hello!
Perhaps it should be brought there Enrico, old chap, but I find it rather
entertaining. Until Jay or Roger complains we should continue to consider
these issues, until that time.

Besides, some of the things that Bruce has brought out of the darkness
should have been discussed earlier on.

And Greg, for me its not enough soda, Coke or Ginger Pop (ale) your choice.
--
Gregg C Levine hansolofalcon@...
"The Force will be with you always." Obi-Wan Kenobi

> -----Original Message-----
> From: hercules-390@yahoogroups.com [mailto:hercules-390@yahoogroups.com]
On
> Behalf Of Enrico Sorichetti
> Sent: Thursday, June 12, 2008 12:20 PM
> To: hercules-390@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [hercules-390] Re: Freakin' IBM...
>
> --- In hercules-390@yahoogroups.com, "BruceTSmith" <brucetsmith@...>
wrote:
> >
> > ref too many...
>
> THE ISSUE IS NOT HERCULES RELATED
> can You gentleman be so kind take the tread somewhere
> ADVOCACY might be the best place
> or somebody activate a SOAPBOX forum
>
> thank You for the courtesy
> regards
> enrico sorichetti
>

6:31 pm

Re: Freakin' IBM...

Jay Maynard

Jun 12, 2008

On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 02:31:29PM -0400, Gregg C Levine wrote:
> Perhaps it should be brought there Enrico, old chap, but I find it rather
> entertaining. Until Jay or Roger complains we should continue to consider
> these issues, until that time.

I apologize for not keeping a close eye on this group...I've been tied up
with the details of taking delivery of my new airplane. (Whee! Check out my
LiveJournal for more.)

Enrico is right, though: this belongs on .advocacy. That's what the group
was created for.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
http://www.hercules-390.org (Yes, that's me!)
Buy Hercules stuff at http://www.cafepress.com/hercules-390

6:41 pm