Tech Insider					     Technology and Trends


			      USENET Archives

Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4,comp.unix.sysv386
Path: sparky!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!pacific.mps.ohio-state.edu!
linac!att!cbnewsm!corey
From: co...@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (william.c.brown)
Subject: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!
Organization: AT&T
Distribution: usa
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 23:54:43 GMT
Message-ID: <1992Nov19.235443.14962@cbnewsm.cb.att.com>
Followup-To: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Keywords: Price to beat all prices
Lines: 58


	Well I just downloaded the pricing info from UNIVEL
	on their Unixware SYSVR4.2 product and WOW what a 
	surprise!!! Heres the break down:

	Personal Edition (runtime only) $495.00
	Application server              $2495.00
        Software dev kit                $995.00
        TCP/IP for PE                   $295.00
        Personal utilities              $395.00
        Encryption kit                  $95.00
        C2 auditing  (PE)               $195.00
        C2 auditing  (Server)           $195.00
        Windows merge (PE)              $395.00
        Windows merge (Server)          $995.00
        Veritis file system (Server)    $3285.00

	So if I want to put together a personal edition with the
	dev kit and TCP/IP and personal utilities (BSD stuff)
	heres the total ticket:

	PE      495.00
	Dev     995.00
        TCP     295.00
        Utils   395.00
        Merge   395.00
                --------
        Total   $2575.00        ------- WHAT!!!!! --------


	If I have misread the fax I got from UNIVEL I sure hope
	somebody straightens me out. What happened to price competitive
	with OS/2 and NT??? Even for the runtime 495.00 is 400% higher
	than OS/2..

	What about Consensys?? I just called them I get all of the
	above for $995.00 complete. What gives Univel???

	On that note, does anybody have any experience with the
	new Consensys product or with Consensys in general???

	When will Esix, Dell, etc... have their SYSV4.2 ready???


	I am REALLY disappointed with the UNIVEL pricing, if you
	couldn't tell, and I am prepared to look at other vendors
	for my SYSV4.2 now...


/* -----							*/
/* Corey Brown  (WB0RXQ): 20m, 15m, 2m(146.82) 70cm(443.65)     */
/* AT&T NSD							*/
/* Alpharetta, Ga 30202						*/
/* (404)750-8071						*/
/*			-----------------			*/
/* att!alphlk!wcb          | They're history in terms of the	*/
/* attmail!wcbrown         | future! (lws-91)			*/
/*							  ----- */

Path: sparky!uunet!mcsun!Germany.EU.net!lemis!grog
From: g...@lemis.uucp (Greg Lehey)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Message-ID: <2409@adagio.lemis.uucp>
Date: 21 Dec 92 19:43:21 GMT
References: <BzHCE5.8FG@chinet.chi.il.us> <2406@adagio.lemis.uucp> 
<BzL0p3.A1K@chinet.chi.il.us>
Organization: LEMIS, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany
Lines: 43

In article <BzL0p3....@chinet.chi.il.us> l...@chinet.chi.il.us (Leslie Mikesell) 
writes:
>In article <2...@adagio.lemis.uucp> g...@lemis.uucp (Greg Lehey) writes:
>
>>>Let's suppose that you manage to misconfigure the system such that
>>>it won't boot from the hard disk.  How long does it take to fix
>>>it?
>>
>>That depends on the system and what's wrong with it. I just did this
>>today with UnixWare. I'm still waiting for the tapes to finish.
>
>Dell has an escape clause that sometimes helps if the problem is
>just a bad kernel build.  When you boot up it gives you a few seconds
>to hit the space bar and get a prompt for an alternate kernel to
>boot.  Unix.old is always the last copy that worked.

Funny you should say that. Look:

+ === grog onlyyou:~ 66 -> ls -l /stand
+ total 7096
+ -r--r--r--   1 root     root        3980 Dec 20 14:56 mip
+ -r--r--r--   1 root     root        4204 Dec 20 14:56 sip
+ -rwxr--r--   1 root     root     1945520 Dec 20 17:40 unix
+ -rwxr--r--   1 root     root     1678764 Dec 20 16:14 unix.old
+ === grog onlyyou:~ 67 -> 

The thing is, of course, that I didn't know that, and - like Fred Fish
- didn't know how to get out of the graphics screen. If this had been
documented, it wouldn't have been a problem, but documentation is
almost non-existent.

BTW, the old kernel is the vanilla flavour, the other one adds TCP/IP
and NFS support. Compare with a similar kernel under BSD/386:

+ === root allegro:/ 503 # ls -l
+ -rwxr-xr-x    1 grog       525857 Dec 17 13:51 bsd
+ -rwxr-xr-x    1 root       498637 Apr  3  1992 bsd.generic
+ -rwxr-xr-x    1 grog       525909 Nov 26 13:25 bsd.old
+ lrwxrwxrwx    1 root            3 Oct 19 16:52 vmunix -> bsd
+ === root allegro:/ 504 # 
-- 
Greg Lehey                       | Tel: +49-6637-1488              
LEMIS                            | Fax: +49-6637-1489
Schellnhausen 2, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany

Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Path: sparky!uunet!psinntp!fasttech!zeke
From: z...@fasttech.com (Bohdan Tashchuk)
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Message-ID: <1992Dec22.100028.26428@fasttech.com>
Organization: Fast Technology
References: <1992Dec19.010713.23959@isc-br.isc-br.com>
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 10:00:28 GMT
Lines: 24

In <1992Dec19.010713.23...@isc-br.isc-br.com> ri...@odin.isc-br.com 
(Rick Schaeffer) writes:

>Amen, brother!  I'm **real** biased toward Unix...but I just cannot
>believe that USL/Univel don't seem to understand the economics of volume!
>They could sell many thousands of copies at $150 and take over the 
>home PC market.

You can give Unix away for free and you won't penetrate the home PC market
until you have

	a better dos than dos
	a better Windows than Windows

Ie, you need compatibility with existing applications, or new applications
that are just as good and don't cost any more per copy. The home PC market
isn't going to use Unix unless it runs sofware like Excel and Word for Windows
and Managing Your Money and Prodigy and the hundreds of other apps that people
have accumulated over the years.

This is OBVIOUS, OBVIOUS, OBVIOUS. And has been repeated over and over on
the net. And yet people persist in thinking that all you need to do is lower
Unix's price and the world will beat a path to its door.

Lowering the price is necessary but not sufficient.

Path: sparky!uunet!crdgw1!rdsunx.crd.ge.com!ariel!davidsen
From: david...@ariel.crd.GE.COM (william E Davidsen)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Message-ID: <1992Dec22.202127.8638@crd.ge.com>
Date: 22 Dec 92 20:21:27 GMT
References: <1992Dec18.014048.26507@Celestial.COM> <BzHCE5.8FG@chinet.chi.il.us> 
<2406@adagio.lemis.uucp> <BzL0p3.A1K@chinet.chi.il.us>
Sender: use...@crd.ge.com (Required for NNTP)
Reply-To: david...@crd.ge.com (bill davidsen)
Organization: GE Corporate R&D Center, Schenectady NY
Lines: 14
Nntp-Posting-Host: ariel.crd.ge.com

In article <BzL0p3....@chinet.chi.il.us>, l...@chinet.chi.il.us (Leslie Mikesell) 
writes:

| Dell has an escape clause that sometimes helps if the problem is
| just a bad kernel build.  When you boot up it gives you a few seconds
| to hit the space bar and get a prompt for an alternate kernel to
| boot.  Unix.old is always the last copy that worked.

  And their standard boot floppy has an option to do system maintenence,
too. A fairly painless way to go, although I wish they gave me an easy
way to generate a new boot floppy with my own fiendishly hacked kernel.

-- 
bill davidsen, GE Corp. R&D Center; Box 8; Schenectady NY 12345
    Keyboard controller has been disabled, press F1 to continue.

Path: sparky!uunet!olivea!isc-br!odin!ricks
From: ri...@odin.isc-br.com (Rick Schaeffer)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Message-ID: <1992Dec23.012729.9837@isc-br.isc-br.com>
Date: 23 Dec 92 01:27:29 GMT
References: <1992Dec19.010713.23959@isc-br.isc-br.com> 
<1992Dec22.100028.26428@fasttech.com>
Sender: n...@isc-br.isc-br.com (news user)
Organization: ISC-Bunker Ramo, An Olivetti Company
Lines: 31
Nntp-Posting-Host: odin.isc-br.com

In article <1992Dec22.100028.26...@fasttech.com> z...@fasttech.com 
(Bohdan Tashchuk) writes:
>In <1992Dec19.010713.23...@isc-br.isc-br.com> ri...@odin.isc-br.com 
(Rick Schaeffer) writes:
>
>
>You can give Unix away for free and you won't penetrate the home PC market
>until you have
>
>	a better dos than dos
>	a better Windows than Windows

Granted.  I was assuming that Unixware does all of this (as is
reported).  It's compatibility with dos and windows is supposed to be pretty
good.

>This is OBVIOUS, OBVIOUS, OBVIOUS. And has been repeated over and over on
>the net. And yet people persist in thinking that all you need to do is lower
>Unix's price and the world will beat a path to its door.

Actually, a price of $100-$150 will cause a lot of folks just to buy it out
of curiosity (assuming that the marketing and distribution channels are working
right and that the product is easily available).  OS/2 2.0 sold quite well
initially based on just curiosity.  If it had worked as well as advertised,
the sales might well have kept right on going!  The KEY is price!  People
will buy something and give it a try if the price is low enough.  After that,
continuing sales require that the product work well, is stable, and is
compatible.  First ya got to get your foot in the door....
--
Rick Schaeffer          UUCP:  uunet!isc-br.isc-br.com!ricks
ISC-Bunker Ramo                ri...@isc-br.isc-br.com
Box TAF-C8              Phone: (509)927-5114
Spokane, WA  99220      Home:  (509)928-3533

Path: sparky!uunet!spool.mu.edu!yale.edu!ira.uka.de!Germany.EU.net!lemis!grog
From: g...@lemis.uucp (Greg Lehey)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Message-ID: <2410@adagio.lemis.uucp>
Date: 23 Dec 92 09:03:14 GMT
References: <1992Dec19.010713.23959@isc-br.isc-br.com> 
<1992Dec22.100028.26428@fasttech.com> <1992Dec23.012729.9837@isc-br.isc-br.com>
Organization: LEMIS, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany
Lines: 26

In article <1992Dec23.012729.9...@isc-br.isc-br.com> ri...@odin.isc-br.com 
(Rick Schaeffer) writes:
>In article <1992Dec22.100028.26...@fasttech.com> z...@fasttech.com 
(Bohdan Tashchuk) writes:
>>
>>You can give Unix away for free and you won't penetrate the home PC market
>>until you have
>>
>>	a better dos than dos
>>	a better Windows than Windows
>
>Granted.  I was assuming that Unixware does all of this (as is
>reported).  It's compatibility with dos and windows is supposed to be pretty
>good.

Who reported that? Possibly a Univel marketroid? I've been testing it
recently, and though I agree that it's obviously aimed at DOS users
(there's hardly a mention of UNIX in the complete documentation, but
it does say something to the effect "If you have access to UNIX
documentation, you can also use the shell interface".

The real problem is the relation up there. I haven't used (MS) Windows
in a long time, but I can't imagine that it's worse than what UnixWare
offers. The DOS is DR-DOS 6.0 - is that better or worse than (MS) DOS?
------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
Greg Lehey                       | Tel: +49-6637-1488              
LEMIS                            | Fax: +49-6637-1489
Schellnhausen 2, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany

Path: sparky!uunet!mcsun!Germany.EU.net!lemis!grog
From: g...@lemis.uucp (Greg Lehey)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Message-ID: <2411@adagio.lemis.uucp>
Date: 23 Dec 92 09:06:07 GMT
References: <2406@adagio.lemis.uucp> <BzL0p3.A1K@chinet.chi.il.us> 
<1992Dec22.202127.8638@crd.ge.com>
Organization: LEMIS, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany
Lines: 18

In article <1992Dec22.202127.8...@crd.ge.com> david...@crd.ge.com 
(bill davidsen) writes:
>In article <BzL0p3....@chinet.chi.il.us>, l...@chinet.chi.il.us 
(Leslie Mikesell) writes:
>
>| Dell has an escape clause that sometimes helps if the problem is
>| just a bad kernel build.  When you boot up it gives you a few seconds
>| to hit the space bar and get a prompt for an alternate kernel to
>| boot.  Unix.old is always the last copy that worked.
>
>  And their standard boot floppy has an option to do system maintenence,
>too. A fairly painless way to go, although I wish they gave me an easy
>way to generate a new boot floppy with my own fiendishly hacked kernel.

Have you tried using a utility program such as DOS/diskcopy to make a
physical copy of the boot disk, then mount it and replace the kernel?
---- 
Greg Lehey                       | Tel: +49-6637-1488              
LEMIS                            | Fax: +49-6637-1489
Schellnhausen 2, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany

Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Path: sparky!uunet!cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!menudo.uh.edu!
sugar!ficc!peter
From: pe...@ferranti.com (peter da silva)
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Message-ID: <id.0R2W.M24@ferranti.com>
Organization: Xenix Support, FICC
References: <1992Dec19.010713.23959@isc-br.isc-br.com> 
<1992Dec22.100028.26428@fasttech.com>
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 22:46:48 GMT
Lines: 21

In article <1992Dec22.100028.26...@fasttech.com> z...@fasttech.com 
(Bohdan Tashchuk) writes:
> You can give Unix away for free and you won't penetrate the home PC market
> until you have

> 	a better dos than dos
> 	a better Windows than Windows

That depends on the definition of penetrate. If you have a good enough product,
you can sell millions of units despite DOS emulation problems... look at the
Amiga or Macintosh. I don't know if UNIX is far enough ahead on other areas
to still be able to pull this off, though. The gap is narrowing.

But you DO need the ability to stick the machine in a naive user's hands and
let them rip. You think UNIX can handle that? When you can stick the machine
on a showroom floor, unmonitored, with the root password taped to the monitor
without having to reload it every day *then* it's ready.
-- 
Peter da Silva                                            `-_-'
Ferranti International Controls Corporation                'U` 
Sugar Land, TX  77487-5012 USA
+1 713 274 5180                            "Zure otsoa besarkatu al duzu gau

Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Path: sparky!uunet!gatech!destroyer!mudos!mju
From: m...@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us (Marc Unangst)
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Message-ID: <Bzqv2E.Ln8@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us>
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 03:30:13 GMT
References: <1992Dec19.010713.23959@isc-br.isc-br.com> 
<1992Dec22.100028.26428@fasttech.com> <id.0R2W.M24@ferranti.com>
Organization: The Programmer's Pit Stop, Ann Arbor MI
Lines: 13

In article <id.0R2W....@ferranti.com> pe...@ferranti.com (peter da silva) writes:
>let them rip. You think UNIX can handle that? When you can stick the machine
>on a showroom floor, unmonitored, with the root password taped to the monitor
>without having to reload it every day *then* it's ready.

You can't do this with DOS, either.  It's just as easy to type "del
c:\command.com" as it is to type "rm /vmunix".

-- 
Marc Unangst, N8VRH         | "Of course, in order to understand this you
m...@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us   |  have to remember that the nucleus of the atom
                            |  is squishy."
                            |    -W. Scheider, from a Physics lecture

Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Path: sparky!uunet!wupost!cs.utexas.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!
menudo.uh.edu!sugar!ficc!peter
From: pe...@ferranti.com (peter da silva)
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Message-ID: <id.CS3W.9X8@ferranti.com>
Organization: Xenix Support, FICC
References: <1992Dec22.100028.26428@fasttech.com> <id.0R2W.M24@ferranti.com> 
<Bzqv2E.Ln8@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us>
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 22:24:01 GMT
Lines: 22

In article <Bzqv2E....@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us> m...@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us 
(Marc Unangst) writes:
> In article <id.0R2W....@ferranti.com> pe...@ferranti.com (peter da silva) 
writes:
> >let them rip. You think UNIX can handle that? When you can stick the machine
> >on a showroom floor, unmonitored, with the root password taped to the monitor
> >without having to reload it every day *then* it's ready.

> You can't do this with DOS, either.  It's just as easy to type "del
> c:\command.com" as it is to type "rm /vmunix".

It's easier to type "rm /* .bak". And it's easier to boot off a floppy
and copy command.com back in.

I was also thinking of people naively messing with the system config files.
I just had someone render a UNIX box unhappy by changing the root shell
to /sbin/csh. With DOS if you do something like that, you can easily boot
off floppy and fix it. With UNIX you need to have someone capable of
cracking UNIX security, including making a custom boot floppy.
-- 
Peter da Silva                                            `-_-'
Ferranti International Controls Corporation                'U` 
Sugar Land, TX  77487-5012 USA
+1 713 274 5180                            "Zure otsoa besarkatu al duzu gaur?"

Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Path: sparky!uunet!gumby!destroyer!mudos!mju
From: m...@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us (Marc Unangst)
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Message-ID: <Bzss9r.Ds8@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us>
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1992 04:25:02 GMT
References: <id.0R2W.M24@ferranti.com> <Bzqv2E.Ln8@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us> 
<id.CS3W.9X8@ferranti.com>
Organization: The Programmer's Pit Stop, Ann Arbor MI
Lines: 32

In article <id.CS3W....@ferranti.com> pe...@ferranti.com (peter da silva) writes:
>It's easier to type "rm /* .bak". And it's easier to boot off a floppy
>and copy command.com back in.

Since when do you store backup files in the root directory?

>I was also thinking of people naively messing with the system config files.
>I just had someone render a UNIX box unhappy by changing the root shell
>to /sbin/csh. With DOS if you do something like that, you can easily boot
>off floppy and fix it. With UNIX you need to have someone capable of
>cracking UNIX security, including making a custom boot floppy.

Well, with Unix you can boot off a floppy and fix it as well.  You
don't need a custom boot floppy; what's wrong with the boot floppies
the OS came with?

But yes, having security usually means you will have lockouts as well.
And you can deal with that either by getting used to having an
occasional lockout, or by reducing security.  DOS cures the lockout
problem by not having security.  I prefer a bit more secure approach.

Personally, I was somewhat peeved when, after locking my keys in my
car a month ago and having to call AAA to come unlock it, the towing
guy didn't even ask to see the vehicle registration before he
slim-jimed the door.  How did he know it was my car (other than the
fact I claimed ownership)?

-- 
Marc Unangst, N8VRH         | "Of course, in order to understand this you
m...@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us   |  have to remember that the nucleus of the atom
                            |  is squishy."
                            |    -W. Scheider, from a Physics lecture

Path: sparky!uunet!math.fu-berlin.de!news.netmbx.de!Germany.EU.net!lemis!grog
From: g...@lemis.uucp (Greg Lehey)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Message-ID: <2412@adagio.lemis.uucp>
Date: 27 Dec 92 17:42:07 GMT
References: <Bzqv2E.Ln8@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us> <id.CS3W.9X8@ferranti.com> 
<Bzss9r.Ds8@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us>
Organization: LEMIS, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany
Lines: 12

In article <Bzss9r....@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us> m...@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us 
(Marc Unangst) writes:
>Well, with Unix you can boot off a floppy and fix it as well.  You
>don't need a custom boot floppy; what's wrong with the boot floppies
>the OS came with?

In the case of the new SVR4.2 offerings, they don't give you a chance
to start a shell - that's wizardry, and Unix for the Masses (not yet
(tm)) doesn't cater for that sort of thing.
-- 
Greg Lehey                       | Tel: +49-6637-1488              
LEMIS                            | Fax: +49-6637-1489
Schellnhausen 2, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany

Path: sparky!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!olivea!spool.mu.edu!agate!
doc.ic.ac.uk!pipex!bnr.co.uk!uknet!root44!uel!news
From: n...@uel.co.uk (Netnews Administration)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Summary: how to recover from floppy - svr4.2
Message-ID: <1679@uel.co.uk>
Date: 30 Dec 92 09:25:01 GMT
References: <id.CS3W.9X8@ferranti.com> <Bzss9r.Ds8@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us> 
<2412@adagio.lemis.uucp>
Organization: UNIX System Laboratories, Europe Ltd.
Lines: 48

In article <2...@adagio.lemis.uucp> g...@lemis.uucp (Greg Lehey) writes:
>In article <Bzss9r....@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us> m...@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us 
(Marc Unangst) writes:
>>Well, with Unix you can boot off a floppy and fix it as well.  You
>>don't need a custom boot floppy; what's wrong with the boot floppies
>>the OS came with?
>
>In the case of the new SVR4.2 offerings, they don't give you a chance
>to start a shell - that's wizardry, and Unix for the Masses (not yet
>(tm)) doesn't cater for that sort of thing.

What follows is a summary of how to recover your SVR4.2 system from the
boot floppies. Note that this is for the USL reference binary and has not
been tried on UNIXware or Concensys V4.2.

Here's how to recover:

(1) Insert boot floppy1 and bring your system up, then Insert boot 
    floppy2 as prompted.

(2) Go through fdisk(1M) without changing your partitions allocation. 
   (i.e. type "5" for exit at the screen asking you whether to create 
    a partition, delete a partition, etc.) . You do not need to choose 
   to create partitions on the second hard disk. The boot flops will figure 
   out whether you were using it.

(3) At the screen asking you to choose between non-destructive/destructive 
    installation, choose (1) for non-destructive install.

(4) Insert the third floppy when prompted.

(5) When you see the prompt to remove the third floppy, hit DEL.

(6) You will see a screen asking you to choose between resuming install or 
    canceling the installation.  Just hit DEL here. You may need to hit it 
    a couple times.  You should then see a prompt ("#").

(7) Do what you need to do. Note the following:

    -- You can now put any floppy you wish into either floppy drive,
       and you should have access to your tape controller if it is
       there.
    -- you have up to 2 serial ports configured in your kernel.
    -- you have no networking.
    -- your root file system is mounted as "/" (as opposed to
       /install or /mnt). Other file systems except /home
       and /tmp are mounted on it. You will need to mount /tmp and /home.
    -- you should be able to run standard editing commands (like vi)
       since all libraries will be available to you.

Path: sparky!uunet!math.fu-berlin.de!news.netmbx.de!Germany.EU.net!lemis!grog
From: g...@lemis.uucp (Greg Lehey)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.sys5.r4
Subject: Re: What is lacking in UNIX? (Re: UNIVEL MUST BE KIDDING!!!!!)
Message-ID: <2413@adagio.lemis.uucp>
Date: 31 Dec 92 10:16:52 GMT
References: <Bzss9r.Ds8@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us> <2412@adagio.lemis.uucp> 
<1679@uel.co.uk>
Organization: LEMIS, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany
Lines: 90

In article <1...@uel.co.uk> n...@uel.co.uk (Netnews Administration) writes:
>In article <2...@adagio.lemis.uucp> g...@lemis.uucp (Greg Lehey) writes:
>>In the case of the new SVR4.2 offerings, they don't give you a chance
>>to start a shell - that's wizardry, and Unix for the Masses (not yet
>>(tm)) doesn't cater for that sort of thing.
>
>What follows is a summary of how to recover your SVR4.2 system from the
>boot floppies. Note that this is for the USL reference binary and has not
>been tried on UNIXware or Concensys V4.2.

I tried it on Consensys V4.2. Here's what happened:

>Here's how to recover:
>
>(1) Insert boot floppy1 and bring your system up, then Insert boot 
>    floppy2 as prompted.

Elapsed time 1:30

>(2) Go through fdisk(1M) without changing your partitions allocation. 

(3:30)

>   (i.e. type "5" for exit at the screen asking you whether to create 
>    a partition, delete a partition, etc.) . You do not need to choose 
>   to create partitions on the second hard disk. The boot flops will figure 
>   out whether you were using it.
>
>(3) At the screen asking you to choose between non-destructive/destructive 
>    installation, choose (1) for non-destructive install.

It still copies files to disk, not a good idea if you're using the
boot floppies because of a file system crash.

>(4) Insert the third floppy when prompted.

(after 5:30)

>(5) When you see the prompt to remove the third floppy, hit DEL.

Here the installation obviously differs. First, Consensys asks for a
validation key (UnixWare doesn't, at least not the version I have).
Then it copies more files to disk. After a total elapsed time of 9
minutes it asks you whether you want automatic or custom installation.
I hit DEL here.

>(6) You will see a screen asking you to choose between resuming install or 
>    canceling the installation.  Just hit DEL here. You may need to hit it 
>    a couple times.  You should then see a prompt ("#").

Hitting DEL here brings the message ``you can't hit DEL here''.
Hitting it a third time brings a # prompt.

>(7) Do what you need to do. Note the following:
>
>    -- You can now put any floppy you wish into either floppy drive,
>       and you should have access to your tape controller if it is
>       there.

Seems reasonable. At least, no floppy was mounted.

>    -- you have up to 2 serial ports configured in your kernel.
>    -- you have no networking.
>    -- your root file system is mounted as "/" (as opposed to
>       /install or /mnt). Other file systems except /home
>       and /tmp are mounted on it. You will need to mount /tmp and /home.

This does not match with Consensys. /dev/root is mounted on /root.
Since there is only one file system (apart from /stand, which was
mounted, but I forget where), I can't verify whether or not /tmp and
/home were mounted.

>    -- you should be able to run standard editing commands (like vi)
>       since all libraries will be available to you.

... once you set up the PATH to point to the correct directories.

(end of report)

Many thanks for the information. There's obviously room for
improvement, though: first, you need to go through a significant
portion of the installation to get that far, and I don't like to have
to copy files to disk in order to boot from floppy. Presumably there's
a way to make a variant of the first or second boot floppy which
starts a shell instead of the installation script.

-- 
Greg Lehey                       | Tel: +49-6637-1488              
LEMIS                            | Fax: +49-6637-1489
Schellnhausen 2, W-6324 Feldatal, Germany

			        About USENET

USENET (Users’ Network) was a bulletin board shared among many computer
systems around the world. USENET was a logical network, sitting on top
of several physical networks, among them UUCP, BLICN, BERKNET, X.25, and
the ARPANET. Sites on USENET included many universities, private companies
and research organizations. See USENET Archives.

		       SCO Files Lawsuit Against IBM

March 7, 2003 - The SCO Group filed legal action against IBM in the State 
Court of Utah for trade secrets misappropriation, tortious interference, 
unfair competition and breach of contract. The complaint alleges that IBM 
made concentrated efforts to improperly destroy the economic value of 
UNIX, particularly UNIX on Intel, to benefit IBM's Linux services 
business. See SCO vs IBM.

The materials and information included in this website may only be used
for purposes such as criticism, review, private study, scholarship, or
research.

Electronic mail:			       WorldWideWeb:
   tech-insider@outlook.com			  http://tech-insider.org/