Newsgroups: comp.os.os2,comp.os.os2.misc,comp.windows.misc, comp.windows.ms,comp.windows.news Path: sparky!uunet!munnari.oz.au!metro!ob1!tscc2!peterd From: pet...@tscc2.macarthur.uws.edu.au (Peter Degotardi) Subject: Windows NT Message-ID: <peterd.699246927@tscc2> Sender: n...@uws.EDU.AU Organization: University of Western Sydney Date: Fri, 28 Feb 1992 03:15:27 GMT From March `Your Computer' "Windows NT needs 8Mb of RAM" "RICK VIZACHERO, an editor for Government Computer News, recently reported in his column that the demo version of Microsoft's Windows NT operating environment is less than friendly when it comes to older MS-DOS applications' software of hardware. Having seen it running on a 75MHz 80486-based computer, a workstation, and a 33MHz 80386, he reports that it appears the new 32-bit operating system, wich Microsoft is putting up against the long-awaited IBM OS/2 2.0, will require a minimum of a 33MHz 80386 with 8Mb of memory to run. A Microsoft demo technician reportedly gave out the stand- ard line that 'well-behaved' MS-DOS programmings are running OK under the as-yet unfinished Windows NT, but that some, nota- bly those that deal directly with hardware, are having prob- lems. One computer industry insider pointed out the 'well-be- haved' is just code for 'this one works!' " Any comments anyone ? (Don't mail please, just post) -- Peter Degotardi ( p.degota...@uws.edu.au ) | Disclaimer: Any opinions expressed University of Western Sydney, Macarthur | are my own, and may not reflect Teaching and Services Computing Centre | those of my employer or anyone Campbelltown, New South Wales, Australia ! | else. (In case you're interested.)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc,comp.windows.misc,comp.windows.ms Path: sparky!uunet!uchinews!ellis!sip1 From: s...@ellis.uchicago.edu (Timothy F. Sipples) Subject: Re: Windows NT Message-ID: <1992Feb28.031915.4200@midway.uchicago.edu> Followup-To: comp.windows.ms Sender: n...@uchinews.uchicago.edu (News System) Reply-To: s...@midway.uchicago.edu Organization: Dept. of Econ., Univ. of Chicago References: <peterd.699246927@tscc2> Date: Fri, 28 Feb 1992 03:19:15 GMT In article <peterd.699246927@tscc2> pet...@tscc2.macarthur.uws.edu.au (Peter Degotardi) writes: >From March `Your Computer' >"Windows NT needs 8Mb of RAM" >"RICK VIZACHERO, an editor for Government Computer News, >recently reported in his column that the demo version of >Microsoft's Windows NT operating environment is less than >friendly when it comes to older MS-DOS applications' software >of hardware. > Having seen it running on a 75MHz 80486-based computer, a >workstation, and a 33MHz 80386, he reports that it appears the >new 32-bit operating system, wich Microsoft is putting up >against the long-awaited IBM OS/2 2.0, will require a minimum >of a 33MHz 80386 with 8Mb of memory to run. > A Microsoft demo technician reportedly gave out the stand- >ard line that 'well-behaved' MS-DOS programmings are running OK >under the as-yet unfinished Windows NT, but that some, nota- >bly those that deal directly with hardware, are having prob- >lems. > One computer industry insider pointed out the 'well-be- >haved' is just code for 'this one works!' " >Any comments anyone ? (Don't mail please, just post) Yes. Windows NT is alpha (and maybe even pre-alpha) code. It is nowhere near ready for prime time. Anything can change. However, while Microsoft statements are a bit contradictory, they too have indicated that a 33 MHz 80386DX with 8 MB of memory is a realistic minimum configuration. They have also stated that NT will run "well behaved" DOS and 16-bit Windows applications. But one thing they have not said (at least as of late) is that they are "putting up [NT] against the long-awaited IBM OS/2 2.0." NT is clearly intended to be a platform for servers and high end workstations (to compete against NetWare, Unix, and future versions of OS/2, for example). It will probably trickle down (over time) to the client side, but that's not the initial point of entry it seems. NT will also be delivered some number of months after OS/2 2.0. Backward compatibility is key, it seems. But on the bright side, hardware is always getting cheaper, so perhaps an 80486 with 16 MB on every desktop isn't too far off. Also, NT has some interesting features (at least on paper) that aren't satisfied today (although "some months" is an eternity in the software industry). Granted, NT will cost more, but according to reports its price (circa $500) isn't too far out of line with Novell NetWare and Unix, for example. Novell is king right now, and it will be a difficult market to crack, but competition is always healthy. -- Timothy F. Sipples Keeper of the OS/2 Frequently Asked Questions s...@ellis.uchicago.edu List, available via anonymous ftp from Dept. of Economics 130.57.4.1, directory os2/faq, or via netmail Univ. of Chicago 60637 from LISTS...@BLEKUL11.BITNET.
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2,comp.os.os2.misc,comp.windows.misc,comp.windows.ms, comp.windows.news Path: sparky!uunet!microsoft!alistair From: alist...@microsoft.com (Alistair BANKS) Subject: Re: Windows NT Message-ID: <1992Mar09.152808.10614@microsoft.com> Date: 09 Mar 92 15:28:08 GMT Organization: Microsoft Corp. References: <peterd.699246927@tscc2> <!#8Hj7cv5@cs.psu.edu> Lines: 31 Windows NT was indeed demoed on a 75Mhz 486 at last fall comdex - Intel called this a technology demonstration - This was in addition to Windows NT being demoed on 386, MIPs R4000 workstation, and NCR's 4 * 50Mhz 486 symetric multi-processing machine. As for MS-Dos compatibility, Windows NT has a "virtual device driver" capability which allows any hardware to be virtualised to run 'dirty' apps 'cleanly' - There was probably some truth (though unintended) in the journalists article, since I'm sure that not all the virtual device drivers had been written last fall comdex (not all of them have been written now! We're not finsihed yet!) Windows NT can run all but a few MS-Dos applications which would specifically break its C2 security rating, like apps which try to re-program the disk controller etc. If a 3rd party wants to ensure that their own "special" piece of hardware is supported on Windows NT for MS-Dos apps which used to access the hardware directly, then that 3rd party would write a suitable virtual device driver which would virtualise that 'dirty' access, making it 'clean'. More of this will become clear as Windows NT approaches public pre-release in July, before its commercial release at the end of this year. For various details about Windows NT, including 2.5Mb WinHelp version of the Win32 API spec, use anonymous ftp access to ftp.uu.net, directory ~ftp/vendor/microsoft/win32-api & ./isv-communications - or else access the "mswin32" forum on compuserve, where much detailed discussion is taking place. Alistair Banks, Microsoft Systems Division
Path: sparky!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!swrinde!gatech!taco! garfield.catt.ncsu.edu!linville From: linvi...@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (John W. Linville) Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc,comp.windows.misc,comp.windows.ms,comp.windows.news Subject: Re: Windows NT Message-ID: <1992Mar9.212015.1337@ncsu.edu> Date: 9 Mar 92 21:20:15 GMT References: <peterd.699246927@tscc2> <!#8Hj7cv5@cs.psu.edu> <1992Mar09.152808.10614@microsoft.com> Sender: n...@ncsu.edu (USENET News System) Organization: NCSU CATT Prog Lines: 26 In article <1992Mar09.152808.10...@microsoft.com> alist...@microsoft.com (Alistair BANKS) writes: >As for MS-Dos compatibility, Windows NT has a "virtual device driver" >capability which allows any hardware to be virtualised to run 'dirty' >apps 'cleanly' - There was probably some truth (though unintended) in (Insert tongue in cheek) Virtual device drivers!!! Wow!!!! It's a great thing that Windows NT is going to have such wonderful advances in technology, so much sooner than everyone else will!!! (Remove tongue from cheek) Sorry, I just couldn't resist that one. John W. Linville | John W. Linville Amateur radio: KD4KHC | | #include "std_disclaimer.h" E-mail: linvi...@catt.ncsu.edu | ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Boycott Microsoft
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc,comp.windows.misc,comp.windows.ms,comp.windows.news Path: sparky!uunet!microsoft!gordonl From: gord...@microsoft.com (Gordon Letwin) Subject: Re: Windows NT Message-ID: <1992Mar29.214902.11087@microsoft.com> Date: 29 Mar 92 21:49:02 GMT Organization: Microsoft Corp. References: <!#8Hj7cv5@cs.psu.edu> <1992Mar09.152808.10614@microsoft.com> <1992Mar9.212015.1337@ncsu.edu> Lines: 41 In article <1992Mar9.212015.1...@ncsu.edu> linvi...@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (John W. Linville) writes: >In article <1992Mar09.152808.10...@microsoft.com> alist...@microsoft.com (Alistair BANKS) writes: >>As for MS-Dos compatibility, Windows NT has a "virtual device driver" >>capability which allows any hardware to be virtualised to run 'dirty' >>apps 'cleanly' - There was probably some truth (though unintended) in > >(Insert tongue in cheek) > >Virtual device drivers!!! Wow!!!! It's a great thing that Windows NT is going >to have such wonderful advances in technology, so much sooner than everyone >else will!!! > >(Remove tongue from cheek) > >Sorry, I just couldn't resist that one. > >John W. Linville You should have resisted that one. This is another case of those who don't know what's going on not letting that stop them from bashing whoever is playing the role of "great satan" that particular day... There are "Virtual Device Drivers" in NT, people sarcastically point out that theyare also present in OS/2, and are in fact called the same thing. There's a reason for that. Virtual Device Drivers were originally designed and developed at Microsoft. As part of the WIN386 project. Windows users can see lots of "*.VDD" files in their system subdirectory. This design was then used in OS/2 2.0, BY MICROSOFT. Microsoft programmers did all of this work. IBM is just shipping it. So it's not big surprise that this proven technology; created and developed here at Microsoft, will also be present in NT. I know that these facts will just generate further vituperative and braindead hate mail, but reality exists. Sorry about that. gordon letwin not a microsoft spokesperson