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Newsgroups: comp.os.os2,comp.os.os2.misc,comp.windows.misc,
comp.windows.ms,comp.windows.news
Path: sparky!uunet!munnari.oz.au!metro!ob1!tscc2!peterd
From: pet...@tscc2.macarthur.uws.edu.au (Peter Degotardi)
Subject: Windows NT
Message-ID: <peterd.699246927@tscc2>
Sender: n...@uws.EDU.AU
Organization: University of Western Sydney
Date: Fri, 28 Feb 1992 03:15:27 GMT



From March `Your Computer'

"Windows NT needs 8Mb of RAM"
"RICK VIZACHERO, an editor for Government Computer News,
recently reported in his column that the demo version of
Microsoft's Windows NT operating environment is less than
friendly when it comes to older MS-DOS applications' software
of hardware.
  Having seen it running on a 75MHz 80486-based computer, a
workstation, and a 33MHz 80386, he reports that it appears the
new 32-bit operating system, wich Microsoft is putting up
against the long-awaited IBM OS/2 2.0, will require a minimum
of a 33MHz 80386 with 8Mb of memory to run.
  A Microsoft demo technician reportedly gave out the stand-
ard line that 'well-behaved' MS-DOS programmings are running OK
under the as-yet unfinished Windows NT, but that some, nota-
bly those that deal directly with hardware, are having prob-
lems.
  One computer industry insider pointed out the 'well-be-
haved' is just code for 'this one works!' "

Any comments anyone ? (Don't mail please, just post)

--
Peter Degotardi ( p.degota...@uws.edu.au ) | Disclaimer: Any opinions expressed 
University of Western Sydney, Macarthur    | are my own, and may not reflect
Teaching and Services Computing Centre     | those of my employer or anyone
Campbelltown, New South Wales, Australia ! | else. (In case you're interested.)

Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc,comp.windows.misc,comp.windows.ms
Path: sparky!uunet!uchinews!ellis!sip1
From: s...@ellis.uchicago.edu (Timothy F. Sipples)
Subject: Re: Windows NT
Message-ID: <1992Feb28.031915.4200@midway.uchicago.edu>
Followup-To: comp.windows.ms
Sender: n...@uchinews.uchicago.edu (News System)
Reply-To: s...@midway.uchicago.edu
Organization: Dept. of Econ., Univ. of Chicago
References: <peterd.699246927@tscc2>
Date: Fri, 28 Feb 1992 03:19:15 GMT

In article <peterd.699246927@tscc2> pet...@tscc2.macarthur.uws.edu.au 
(Peter Degotardi) writes:
>From March `Your Computer'
>"Windows NT needs 8Mb of RAM"
>"RICK VIZACHERO, an editor for Government Computer News,
>recently reported in his column that the demo version of
>Microsoft's Windows NT operating environment is less than
>friendly when it comes to older MS-DOS applications' software
>of hardware.
>  Having seen it running on a 75MHz 80486-based computer, a
>workstation, and a 33MHz 80386, he reports that it appears the
>new 32-bit operating system, wich Microsoft is putting up
>against the long-awaited IBM OS/2 2.0, will require a minimum
>of a 33MHz 80386 with 8Mb of memory to run.
>  A Microsoft demo technician reportedly gave out the stand-
>ard line that 'well-behaved' MS-DOS programmings are running OK
>under the as-yet unfinished Windows NT, but that some, nota-
>bly those that deal directly with hardware, are having prob-
>lems.
>  One computer industry insider pointed out the 'well-be-
>haved' is just code for 'this one works!' "
>Any comments anyone ? (Don't mail please, just post)

Yes.  Windows NT is alpha (and maybe even pre-alpha) code.  It is
nowhere near ready for prime time.  Anything can change.

However, while Microsoft statements are a bit contradictory, they too
have indicated that a 33 MHz 80386DX with 8 MB of memory is a
realistic minimum configuration.  They have also stated that NT will
run "well behaved" DOS and 16-bit Windows applications.  But one thing
they have not said (at least as of late) is that they are "putting up
[NT] against the long-awaited IBM OS/2 2.0."  NT is clearly intended
to be a platform for servers and high end workstations (to compete
against NetWare, Unix, and future versions of OS/2, for example).  It
will probably trickle down (over time) to the client side, but that's
not the initial point of entry it seems.  NT will also be delivered
some number of months after OS/2 2.0.

Backward compatibility is key, it seems.  But on the bright side,
hardware is always getting cheaper, so perhaps an 80486 with 16 MB on
every desktop isn't too far off.  Also, NT has some interesting
features (at least on paper) that aren't satisfied today (although
"some months" is an eternity in the software industry).  Granted, NT
will cost more, but according to reports its price (circa $500) isn't
too far out of line with Novell NetWare and Unix, for example.  Novell
is king right now, and it will be a difficult market to crack, but
competition is always healthy.
-- 
Timothy F. Sipples          Keeper of the OS/2 Frequently Asked Questions
s...@ellis.uchicago.edu     List, available via anonymous ftp from
Dept. of Economics          130.57.4.1, directory os2/faq, or via netmail
Univ. of Chicago  60637     from LISTS...@BLEKUL11.BITNET.

Newsgroups: comp.os.os2,comp.os.os2.misc,comp.windows.misc,comp.windows.ms,
comp.windows.news
Path: sparky!uunet!microsoft!alistair
From: alist...@microsoft.com (Alistair BANKS)
Subject: Re: Windows NT
Message-ID: <1992Mar09.152808.10614@microsoft.com>
Date: 09 Mar 92 15:28:08 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corp.
References: <peterd.699246927@tscc2> <!#8Hj7cv5@cs.psu.edu>
Lines: 31

Windows NT was indeed demoed on a 75Mhz 486 at last fall comdex - Intel
called this a technology demonstration - This was in addition to Windows NT
being demoed on 386, MIPs R4000 workstation, and NCR's 4 * 50Mhz 486
symetric multi-processing machine.

As for MS-Dos compatibility, Windows NT has a "virtual device driver"
capability which allows any hardware to be virtualised to run 'dirty'
apps 'cleanly' - There was probably some truth (though unintended) in
the journalists article, since I'm sure that not all the virtual
device drivers had been written last fall comdex (not all of them
have been written now!  We're not finsihed yet!)

Windows NT can run all but a few MS-Dos applications which would
specifically break its C2 security rating, like apps which try
to re-program the disk controller etc.

If a 3rd party wants to ensure that their own "special" piece of hardware
is supported on Windows NT for MS-Dos apps which used to access
the hardware directly, then that 3rd party would write a suitable
virtual device driver which would virtualise that 'dirty' access,
making it 'clean'.

More of this will become clear as Windows NT approaches public pre-release
in July, before its commercial release at the end of this year. For
various details about Windows NT, including 2.5Mb WinHelp version of
the Win32 API spec, use anonymous ftp access to ftp.uu.net, directory
~ftp/vendor/microsoft/win32-api & ./isv-communications - or else
access the "mswin32" forum on compuserve, where much detailed discussion
is taking place.

Alistair Banks, Microsoft Systems Division

Path: sparky!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!swrinde!gatech!taco!
garfield.catt.ncsu.edu!linville
From: linvi...@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu (John W. Linville)
Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc,comp.windows.misc,comp.windows.ms,comp.windows.news
Subject: Re: Windows NT
Message-ID: <1992Mar9.212015.1337@ncsu.edu>
Date: 9 Mar 92 21:20:15 GMT
References: <peterd.699246927@tscc2> <!#8Hj7cv5@cs.psu.edu> 
<1992Mar09.152808.10614@microsoft.com>
Sender: n...@ncsu.edu (USENET News System)
Organization: NCSU CATT Prog
Lines: 26

In article <1992Mar09.152808.10...@microsoft.com> alist...@microsoft.com 
(Alistair BANKS) writes:
>As for MS-Dos compatibility, Windows NT has a "virtual device driver"
>capability which allows any hardware to be virtualised to run 'dirty'
>apps 'cleanly' - There was probably some truth (though unintended) in

(Insert tongue in cheek)

Virtual device drivers!!!  Wow!!!!  It's a great thing that Windows NT is going
to have such wonderful advances in technology, so much sooner than everyone
else will!!!

(Remove tongue from cheek)

Sorry, I just couldn't resist that one.

John W. Linville






|  John W. Linville                Amateur radio:  KD4KHC                  |
|  #include "std_disclaimer.h"     E-mail:  linvi...@catt.ncsu.edu         |
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Boycott Microsoft

Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc,comp.windows.misc,comp.windows.ms,comp.windows.news
Path: sparky!uunet!microsoft!gordonl
From: gord...@microsoft.com (Gordon Letwin)
Subject: Re: Windows NT
Message-ID: <1992Mar29.214902.11087@microsoft.com>
Date: 29 Mar 92 21:49:02 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corp.
References: <!#8Hj7cv5@cs.psu.edu> <1992Mar09.152808.10614@microsoft.com> 
<1992Mar9.212015.1337@ncsu.edu>
Lines: 41

In article <1992Mar9.212015.1...@ncsu.edu> linvi...@garfield.catt.ncsu.edu 
(John W. Linville) writes:
>In article <1992Mar09.152808.10...@microsoft.com> alist...@microsoft.com 
(Alistair BANKS) writes:
>>As for MS-Dos compatibility, Windows NT has a "virtual device driver"
>>capability which allows any hardware to be virtualised to run 'dirty'
>>apps 'cleanly' - There was probably some truth (though unintended) in
>
>(Insert tongue in cheek)
>
>Virtual device drivers!!!  Wow!!!!  It's a great thing that Windows NT is going
>to have such wonderful advances in technology, so much sooner than everyone
>else will!!!
>
>(Remove tongue from cheek)
>
>Sorry, I just couldn't resist that one.
>
>John W. Linville


You should have resisted that one.  This is another case of those who
don't know what's going on not letting that stop them from bashing whoever
is playing the role of "great satan" that particular day...

There are "Virtual Device Drivers" in NT, people sarcastically point
out that theyare also present in OS/2, and are in fact called the same
thing.  There's a reason for that.

Virtual Device Drivers were originally designed and developed at Microsoft.
As part of the WIN386 project.  Windows users can see lots of "*.VDD" files
in their system subdirectory.  This design was then used in OS/2 2.0,
BY MICROSOFT.  Microsoft programmers did all of this work.  IBM is just
shipping it.

So it's not big surprise that this proven technology; created and developed
here at Microsoft, will also be present in NT.

I know that these facts will just generate further vituperative and
braindead hate mail, but reality exists.  Sorry about that.

	gordon letwin
	not a microsoft spokesperson

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