From: l...@gnu-life.ai.mit.edu (Leonard H. Tower Jr.) Subject: Linux and the GNU system by Richard Stallman Date: 1996/05/31 Message-ID: <4onulk$p3t@life.ai.mit.edu> X-Deja-AN: 157818415 sender: to...@prep.ai.mit.edu organization: GNU Project followup-to: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.linux.misc, comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.advocacy newsgroups: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.linux.misc, comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.advocacy Here is the text of the file etc/LINUX-GNU from the GNU Emacs distribution. I am posting it in the hope those concerned about this issue will read and consider what rms actually has to say, instead of what people are claiming he said. New thoughts about additional ways to accomplish his objectives welcome. I am posting it to these newsgroups: gnu.misc.discuss comp.os.linux.misc comp.os.linux.development.apps comp.os.linux.advocacy If discussion about this issue is also occurring in other newsgroups, I ask that you re-post this article in them. thanx -len http://www.ai.mit.edu/~tower/home.html Director, Free Software Foundation Member, League for Programming Freedom, ask: l...@uunet.uu.net, surf: http://www.lpf.org ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Linux and the GNU system The GNU project started 12 years ago with the goal of developing a complete free Unix-like operating system. "Free" refers to freedom, not price; it means you are free to run, copy, distribute, study, change, and improve the software. A Unix-like system consists of many different programs. We found some components already available as free software--for example, X Windows and TeX. We obtained other components by helping to convince their developers to make them free--for example, the Berkeley network utilities. Other components we wrote specifically for GNU--for example, GNU Emacs, the GNU C compiler, the GNU C library, Bash, and Ghostscript. The components in this last category are "GNU software". The GNU system consists of all three categories together. The GNU project is not just about developing and distributing free software. The heart of the GNU project is an idea: that software should be free, and that the users' freedom is worth defending. For if people have freedom but do not value it, they will not keep it for long. In order to make freedom last, we have to teach people to value it. The GNU project's method is that free software and the idea of users' freedom support each other. We develop GNU software, and as people encounter GNU programs or the GNU system and start to use them, they also think about the GNU idea. The software shows that the idea can work in practice. People who come to agree with the idea are likely to write additional free software. Thus, the software embodies the idea, spreads the idea, and grows from the idea. This method was working well--until someone combined the Linux kernel with the GNU system (which still lacked a kernel), and called the combination a "Linux system." The Linux kernel is a free Unix-compatible kernel written by Linus Torvalds. It was not written specifically for the GNU project, but the Linux kernel and the GNU system work together well. In fact, adding Linux to the GNU system brought the system to completion: it made a free Unix-compatible operating system available for use. But ironically, the practice of calling it a "Linux system" undermines our method of communicating the GNU idea. At first impression, a "Linux system" sounds like something completely distinct from the "GNU system." And that is what most users think it is. Most introductions to the "Linux system" acknowledge the role played by the GNU software components. But they don't say that the system as a whole is more or less the same GNU system that the GNU project has been compiling for a decade. They don't say that the idea of a free Unix-like system originates from the GNU project. So most users don't know these things. This leads many of those users to identify themselves as a separate community of "Linux users", distinct from the GNU user community. They use all of the GNU software; in fact, they use almost all of the GNU system; but they don't think of themselves as GNU users, and they may not think about the GNU idea. It leads to other problems as well--even hampering cooperation on software maintenance. Normally when users change a GNU program to make it work better on a particular system, they send the change to the maintainer of that program; then they work with the maintainer, explaining the change, arguing for it and sometimes rewriting it, to get it installed. But people who think of themselves as "Linux users" are more likely to release a forked "Linux-only" version of the GNU program, and consider the job done. We want each and every GNU program to work "out of the box" on Linux-based systems; but if the users do not help, that goal becomes much harder to achieve. So how should the GNU project respond? What should we do now to spread the idea that freedom for computer users is important? We should continue to talk about the freedom to share and change software--and to teach other users to value these freedoms. If we enjoy having a free operating system, it makes sense for us to think about preserving those freedoms for the long term. If we enjoy having a variety of free software, it makes sense for to think about encouraging others to write additional free software, instead of additional proprietary software. We should not accept the splitting of the community in two. Instead we should spread the word that "Linux systems" are variant GNU systems--that users of these systems are GNU users, and that they ought to consider the GNU philosophy which brought these systems into existence. This article is one way of doing that. Another way is to use the terms "Linux-based GNU system" (or "GNU/Linux system" or "Lignux" for short) to refer to the combination of the Linux kernel and the GNU system. Copyright 1996 Richard Stallman Verbatim copying and redistribution is permitted without royalty as long as this notice is preserved. ----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: mi...@ripco.com (Mirai) Subject: Re: Linux and the GNU system by Richard Stallman Date: 1996/06/12 Message-ID: <DsvLIA.ArD@rci.ripco.com> X-Deja-AN: 159762402 sender: use...@rci.ripco.com (Net News Admin) references: <4onulk$p3t@life.ai.mit.edu> <31BB2483.2399E378@lambert.org> <4phfqr$q4h@hamilton.maths.tcd.ie> <31BC954A.5CC7A4D7@lambert.org> x-nntp-sender: mi...@foley.ripco.com organization: Ripco Internet BBS, Chicago newsgroups: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.linux.misc, comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.advocacy ------------------------------------------------------------------------- STALLMAN: "At first impression, a "Linux system" sounds like something completely distinct from the "GNU system." And that is what most users think it is." ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ME: [1] GNU is _not a system_ - GNU is a collection of tools. Linux is a real system: the kernel/distribution/device drivers/binary format/ posix certification/linux ext2fs filesystem/linux directory structure/... If GNU was a system it would be able to obtain POSIX certification. Since it is _not_ an operating system it cannot. It does not have its own filesystem (as does linux), nor does it have a binary executable format. GNU can be used in whole OR in part since it is a collection of tools and _not a system_. GNU can be used on most major kernels/OS platforms _on top of_ existing systems. [2] It really sounds like Mr. Stallman should break off and form his own non-profit corporation and standards committee. Call it the "Open/GNU Consortium" (people will go for anything with "Open" in it) and set up a standards committee. Mr. Stallman can, in turn, advertise for companies to "apply" to the Open/GNU Consortium for certification as an official "GNU SYSTEM" complete with signed document with Mr. Stallman's Seal of Approval. In addition, Stallman is more than welcome to trademark the word GNU(tm) and RESTRICT ITS USE, which is what he is seeking to do, although not outright, by deeming certain distributions contrary to the GNU idea. FURTHERMORE, the GNU idea(tm) should also be copyrighted and fully supported by the Open/GNU Consortium (as well as expounded upon). ------------------------------------------------------------------------- STALLMAN: "We should not accept the splitting of the community in two. Instead we should spread the word that "Linux systems" are variant GNU systems" ------------------------------------------------------------------------- [3] Once again Mr. Stallman is under the impression that he has created an operating system; I hold the opinion that he has not, he has merely "guided" a collection of tools. [4] If, in fact, linux is a "variant GNU system" then by definition there must be a _standard_ GNU system. But there is no standard GNU distribution, no www.gnu.org website (as linux has its www.linux.org), no GNU Journal (witness Linux Journal). If it is Stallman's intention to communicate a STANDARD GNU release (of tools) then it has not been communicated in an obvious way as the Linux community has done in its dissemination of Linux information (HowTo's, FAQ, etc) through its own official channels. This _should_ have been followed (from GNU) by some type of official GNU kernel (Hurd=vaporware?) or release, and official GNU-specific web site, GNU standards body, etc. instead of intermittant communiques directly from Stallman. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TO SUMMARIZE: [4] Stallman's need to control the political climate of free software has become irrelavent, at this point in time, due to the *very* fact that most people, are practicing *free* software ideals and are highly organized (in the case of the linux community) with many channels for distribution and participation for all in the open development of the linux system. [5] The GNU concept, and FSF, the monolythic "Soviet-style" centrally planned "freedom" and philosophy has become irrelavent in today's age of readily available "shareware/freeware" software from the internet. Cheap modems and internet connections have made "free software" and "free software development" more of a reality than the GNU idea(tm). People are increasingly collaborating on free software projects not because of Stallman, GNU, or the FSF, but because the economics of cheap global communications has given us the ability to collaborate via the internet. [6] The move towards a Linux-centric community (rather than a GNU centric community) is good. It preserves "linux standards" such as kernel signal handling, device drivers, the linux ext2fs filesystem, distribution/installation, amount of POSIX support, to name just a few. These issues are out of reach of GNU, since GNU is _not_ implementation specific. In an _implementation_ of UN*X, such that Linux is, we are forced to deal in _specifics_ and what goes into the kernel,and what doesn't, how much SVR4 or BSD or POSIX compatibility one has, etc. Because of this, we join together, _as_ a linux community to determine our own fate as we _all_ contribute, whether in a small or large way, to make linux evolve as a system. [7] Many developers are divorcing themselves from the GNU idea(tm) and embracing the Artistic License, tired of the baggage Stallman brings to the table. Contrary to the GNU idea(tm) the Linux community is very comfortable mixing with both "free" as well as commercial entities. We are not intimidated by any and all players coming into the Linux arena. In fact, Linux will stand to benefit from the efforts of commercial players. Commercial players can standardize on _systems_ such as linux, and not mere collection of tools - as in the case of GNU.
From: t...@maths.tcd.ie (Timothy Murphy) Subject: Re: Linux and the GNU system by Richard Stallman Date: 1996/06/12 Message-ID: <4pm3me$5on@hamilton.maths.tcd.ie>#1/1 X-Deja-AN: 159757378 references: <4onulk$p3t@life.ai.mit.edu> <31BB2483.2399E378@lambert.org> <4phfqr$q4h@hamilton.maths.tcd.ie> <31BC954A.5CC7A4D7@lambert.org> <DsvLIA.ArD@rci.ripco.com> organization: Dept. of Maths, Trinity College, Dublin, Ireland. newsgroups: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.linux.misc, comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.advocacy mi...@ripco.com (Mirai) writes: >ME: [1] GNU is _not a system_ - GNU is a collection of tools. Linux is a >real system: the kernel/distribution/device drivers/binary format/ >posix certification/linux ext2fs filesystem/linux directory structure/... and much more of the same. This is not a legal dispute, or a discussion of Richard Stallman's table manners. To me, the question is quite simple: Would it be good for Linux to be associated with GNU, as eg by calling it (sometimes) GNU/Linux ? [I think Stallman has dropped the "Lignux" suggestion.] First of all, I think this is up to Linus Torvalds. (He seems to have sometimes used the term GNU/Linux himself.) But in my view, it _would_ be to the benefit of Linux to have an official association with GNU. -- Timothy Murphy e-mail: t...@maths.tcd.ie tel: +353-1-2842366 s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland
From: iia...@iifeak.swan.ac.uk (Alan Cox) Subject: Re: Linux and the GNU system by Richard Stallman Date: 1996/06/14 Message-ID: <4prom9$b80@news.swan.ac.uk>#1/1 X-Deja-AN: 160319232 references: <31BC954A.5CC7A4D7@lambert.org> <DsvLIA.ArD@rci.ripco.com> <4pm3me$5on@hamilton.maths.tcd.ie> organization: Institute For Industrial Information Technology newsgroups: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.linux.misc, comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.advocacy In article <4pm3me$...@hamilton.maths.tcd.ie> t...@maths.tcd.ie (Timothy Murphy) writes: >To me, the question is quite simple: >Would it be good for Linux to be associated with GNU, >as eg by calling it (sometimes) GNU/Linux ? With the GNU philosophy yes. With the FSF - well I used to think so, now I am convinced not. Alan -- ----------------------------------------------//// Yow! 233 microsecond remote host TCP latency ---- beat that --------------------------------------------////__________ o Alan Cox, Alan....@linux.org /_____________/ / /\/ /_/ ><